================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: batting helmets question Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 08:00:54 -0700 From: "jcollins12" Here is a quick random question for those of you out there who may be more knowledgable than me on this subject: When were batting helmets made mandatory for both leagues? I thought I remembered that the A.L. made them required in 1958, but recently saw a clip again of Ted Williams' final home run in his last at bat in 1960, and I don't believe he was wearing a helmet. Does anyone know if Ted was simply defying the rule (I don't think I've ever seen a picture of him wearing a helmet, but then again defying rules, if that's what he was doing, was kind of the norm for Teddy Ballgame) or if he had some kind of special exemption from the league? I know there are many pictures and video clips of Mantle wearing a helmet during the second half of his career in the mid-60's. But he played 8 seasons after Williams had retired. I do know that supposedly the first helmet ever worn was by Ralph Kiner over in the National League in the early fifties. Just something I have been wondering about....... ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 13:34:54 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] $4,000 for a 1951 Bowman Ralph Branca To: Jazzgirl1920s@aol.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: mikesportsfan@aol.com I checked the bids on this card. I have never bid on Ebay in the price range this went for, and have a question. What is the bid increment when you get into the low 4 figures? The winning bidder, for $4000 also had the 2nd highest bid at $3800. The third high bid, which was by a different person, was for $3500. Although still ridiculous, I would think the winning bid would be $25 or $50, maybe $100 more than the next highest bid. There really were not that many bidders. Most of the increase came from a couple of ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 13:42:20 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Sims Classic Sports To: grains@dccnet.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: mikesportsfan@aol.com Another note on the Kile autograph and the Branca PSA 9 for $4,000. The winning bidders had extremely low Ebay ratings. One of the bidders had a rating of 10 and the other just changed ID's and have a 0 rating. Wonder if either will pay up. Again the bids on the Kile, had only a couple of people that bid it up. Of the 26 bids, I think there were only 6 differrent bidders. The first bidder may have been working on a set or was a Kile fan. $1.50 is not unreasonable for any autographed card. The other bidders, especially the top 3 are the disgusting people, who think this might be an opportunity to profit, probably. I remember, when Magic Johnson announced 10 years ago that he had AIDS, his cards skyrocketed. Not just autographed cards, but all of his cards. That was prefane in my opinion. A few years ago, Nabisco had a promotion going that you could order some autographed cards from certain HOFers. In the middle of the promotion, Don Drysale died. Nabisco got flooded with orders for him. This is much of the same thinking as grading and Beckett's and mint only. No respect for the hobby, game or others. I think I gave more than my $.02. Mike Rich ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 14:07:17 EDT Subject: kile and economics To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com i wanted to offer my opinion on the sale of kile cards that seems to have some folks upset. i am not sure how others do it, but when i exchange cards, i look at the value of what i received and try to match that with what i send back. that seems fair. in the past, i have looked at a barry bonds cards and thought, maybe i should hold this, because if he gets closer to the all time homer record, it may be worth more. the murazami card became more valuable when nomo joined the majors. i can't see anything wrong with trying to maximize the value of the cards you have. like most of us, i happen to exchange cards, but others out there buy and sell for profit. there will be no more darryl kile cards issued during his lifetime. the supply has now been fixed forever. the value on existing cards may or may not increase -- we will probably find out in the next few months. if i had a stack of kile cards, would there be something wrong with holding them to see if they increase in value? not that i sell them, but they may bring more in exchange or trade in 3 months than they do today. granted, there are folks bidding on kile cards who hope to turn around and sell them for a quick profit. that's american economics, and some may not feel that belongs in our hobby. but do any of us complain if cards we hold today are worth more in three months, and bring us more in trade? i doubt is it morbid to trade on someone's death or other misfortune? perhaps. no one is forcing anyone to do so. does it hurt our hobby? probably no more so than any dealer who buys a card for 50 cents and sells it for $1. everyone has to answer that question for themselves. bottom line, this hobby, like any aspect of our lives that deals with a limited commodity, is affected by supply and demand, and i doubt we will ever be able to escape that. i read many complaints about the prices being charged by dealers, but i also see stories about the great bargains that were found at some little weekend card show. profit drives the american way of life. while it may hurt some aspects of our hobby, it does keep cards in circulation. i doubt that will ever change. i know that i never paid for a card that i didn't want. my 2 cents (plus a 50% markup) worth! gary mandell ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 15:58:57 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] batting helmets question To: jcollins12@triad.rr.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: malsman250@cs.com Well, here's the information according to Bill James.... "Batting helmets were a pet project of Branch Rickey. He required that all of the Pirates to wear them in 1952, so that these valuable young stars that went 49-112 that year wouldn't get hurt and leave them with a bad team. The National League adopted them in 1955, the American League in 1956, with a grandfather clause that if you hadn't worn them before you didn't have to wear them." But somehow seeing Teddy Ballgame with a helmet just wouldn't seem right - sort of like a Harley with training wheels, or something..... ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 16:59:04 EDT Subject: Williams and the helmet To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: friar4@aol.com I am not totally positive about all of this, but my recollection is that when helmets were first introduced in the '50s, they went through a period when they were voluntary. Later on in the decade, they became mandatory for new players, but the existing players, like Williams, were grandfathered with the option of wearing or not. Some decided to wear helmets anyway, but Williams did not want to; although I believe he had some kind of insert in his cap. According to legend, his eyesight was so good, that he did not worry about getting hit. It is said that, when a ball came near his head, his reflexes were so good, he could simply turn his head slightly to let it go ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 21:08:39 EDT Subject: Non-card ramble To: OBC-Ramblings@Yahoogroups.com From: malsman250@cs.com A few of you OBC old-timers may remember me talking about my years in coaching Little League and youth league baseball. Some of my best memories are connected to those years, with the triumphs and disappointments that are part of baseball. It seems like it was only a few weeks back..... And today, I put my son the pitcher on a van to play in a bigger game. He left today to start Marine basic training at Parris Island. I don't mind admitting that it was a tough moment for this father. Frankly, his enlistment in the service was a pretty big surprise to Denise and me. I guess it was pretty much assumed that college was the next step - if the military was in the plan, it would be through ROTC, like his older brother. I recognize that this is what the boy wants. I hope that he finds himself in his new life - he has certainly been searching for himself the last couple of years, and his search has been a difficult one. Thanks for reading along this far. Bill Malson ================= Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 21:32:32 EDT Subject: 2 52 topps players on 1 card available To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- i have an unusual 1952 topps card available- it is card # 9 - Bobby Hogue- (black back) and # 49- Johnny Sain- (black back)- BOTH on the same card- This one card includes parts of both cards- front and back- so if anyone needs 1952 topps #'s 9 & 49 you can get them both on this one card!!i also have 52 topps # 120 - Bob Chakales available- ================= Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 03:39:25 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: Williams and the helmet From: "rayluurs" You are right about the insert inside of regular caps and the part about old timers being grandfathered in. If I remember right the last player to be allowed to play without a helmet was another Red Sox player by the name of Bob Montgomery. Same thing happened when major league baseball went to the ear flap type helmets. The one who played with just helmets were giving the choice of wearing helmets with or without flaps. Alot of th eold timers preferred the flapless helpmets as they felt the flap hurt their periferal vision ================= To: Subject: 1952 & 1953 Mother's Cookies Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 20:49:25 -0700 From: "Dave Fallen" With the help of a few OBC'rs I have begun to put together a check list of Mothers Cookies cards with team designation. Below is the list to date. If you have any of the missing information, I'd apprecite hearing from you. Thanks. 1 Johnny Lindell (Hollywood Stars) 2 Jim Davis (Seattle Rainiers) 3 Al Gettle (Oakland Oaks) 4 Chuck Conners 5 Joe Grace (San Francisco Seals) 6 Eddie Basinski 7 Gene Handley 8 Walt Judnich (Seattle Rainiers) 9 Jim Marshall (Oakland Oaks) 10 Max West 11 Bill Mac Cawley (San Francisco Seals) 12 Moreno Peiretti (Portland Beavers) 13 Fred Haney (Oakland Oaks) 14 Earl Johnson (Seattle Rainiers) 15 Dave Dahle (Oakland Oaks) 16 Bob Talbot (Los Angeles Angels) 17 Smokey Singleton (San Francisco Seals) 18 Frank Austin (Portland Beavers) 19 Joe Gordon (Sacramento Salons) 20 Joe Marty (Sacramento Salons) 21 Bob Gillespie (Sacramento Salons) 22 Red Embree (San Diego Padres) 23 Lefty Olsen (San Diego Padres) 24 Whitey Wietelmann (San Diego Padres) 25 Frank O'Doul 26 Memo Luna (San Diego Padres) 27 John Davis (San Diego Padres) 28 Dick Faber (San Diego Padres) 29 Buddy Peterson (San Diego Padres) 30 Hank Schenz 31 Tookie Gilbert (Oakland Oaks) 32 Mel Ott 33 Sam Chapman 34 John Ragni (Oakland Oaks) 35 Dick Cole (Hollywood Stars) 36 Tom Seffell (Hollywood Stars) 37 Roy Welmaker 38 Lou Stringer 39 Chuck Stevens (Hollywood Stars) 40 Artie Wilson (Seattle Rainiers) 41 Charlie Schanz (Seattle Rainiers) 42 Al Lyons (Seattle Rainiers) 43 Joe Erautt (Seattle Rainiers) 44 Clarence Maddern (Seattle Rainiers) 45 Gene Baker (Los Angeles Angels) 46 Tom Heath (San Francisco Seals) 47 Al Lien (San Francisco Seals) 48 Bill Reeder (San Francisco Seals) 49 Bob Thurman (San Francisco Seals) 50 Ray Orteig (San Francisco Seals) 51 Joe Brovia 52 Jim Russell (Portland Beavers) 53 Fred Sanford (Portland Beavers) 54 Jim Gladd (Portland Beavers) 55 Clay Hopper (Portland Beavers) 56 Bill Glynn (Sacramento Salons) 57 Mike Mccormick (Sacramento Salons) 58 Vinnie Smith 59 Vinnie Smith (Sacramento Salons) 60 Stan Hack 61 Bob Spicer (Los Angeles Angels) 62 Jack Hollis (Los Angeles Angels) 63 Ed Chandler 64 Bill Moisan (Los Angeles Angels) 1 Lee Winter 2 Joe Ostrowski 3 Will Ramsdell 4 Bobby Bragan (Hollywood Stars) 5 Fletcher Robbe 6 Aaron Robinson 7 Augie Galan 8 Buddy Peterson 9 Frank Lefty O'Doul 10 Walt Pocekay 11 Nini Tomay 12 Jim Moran 13 George Schmees (Seattle Rainiers) 14 Al Widmar (Seattle Rainiers) 15 Ritchie Myers (Sacramento Salons) 16 Bill Howerton 17 Chuck Stevens 18 Joe Brovia 19 Max West (Los Angeles Angels) 20 Eddie Malone 21 Gene Handley (Hollywood Stars) 22 William D. McCawley 23 Bill Sweeney 24 Tom Alston (San Diego Padres) 25 George Vico 26 Hank Arft 27 Al Benton 28 "Pete" Milne 29 Jim Gladd 30 Earl Rappp 31 Ray Orteig 32 Eddie Basinski 33 Reno Cheso 34 Clarence Maddern (Seattle Rainiers) 35 Marino Pieretti 36 Bill Raimondi 37 Frank Kelleher 38 George Bamberger (Oakland Oaks) 39 Dick Smith (Los Angeles Angels) 40 Charlie Schantz (Seattle Rainiers) 41 John Van Cuyk 42 Lloyd Hittle 43 Tommy Heath 44 Frank Kalin 45 Jack Tobin (Seattle Rainiers) 46 Jim Davis (Seattle Rainiers) 47 Claude Christy (Seattle Rainiers) 48 Elvin Tappe 49 Stan Hack (Los Angeles Angels) 50 Fred Richards (Los Angeles Angels) 51 Clay Hopper (Portland Beavers) 52 Roy Welmaker (Portland Beavers) 53 Red Adams 54 Piper Davis 55 Spider Jorgensen (Oakland Oaks) 56 Lee Walls (Hollywood Stars) 57 Jack Phillips (Hollywood Stars) 58 Red Lynn 59 Eddie Bockman (Sacramento Salons) 60 Gene Desautels 61 Bob Dillinger (Sacramento Salons) 62 Al Federoff 63 Bill Boemier (San Francisco Seals) ================= Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 21:07:43 EDT Subject: be on the lookout for 1970 #466 To: AMCOOK93@aol.com From: smartalecx@aol.com i received a waiver wire today from ANDY COOK. i was expecting a 1970 topps baseball #466. what i got was a 1958 topps football #1. if someone got the baseball card by mistake, and/or was supposed to get the football card (hopefully the same person), please let me know. tnx, gary mandell ================= Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:08:32 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Wantlist] 2002 Topps Heritage To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: WMDpks@aol.com In a message dated 6/30/2002 3:43:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, cardclctor@aol.com writes: > OK gang, > I know the purists in the group have probably cringed a few times in the > last week or two. Perhaps I should point something out to those of you who > may have recently joined the group and/or remind those that have been > around > a while and weren't paying good attention ;-) There is already an OBC UV > infected server just like this one, only for new junk. I'm not at liberty > to > say who any of the members are, nor am I allowed to tell you how I know > this... just trust me Anyone interested in subscribing to that list may > sign up at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/uvlist or contact Carlos Alcazar ( > alcazar@sympatico.ca) For the record, Kevin also sent the message to which > I'm replying to both servers. Just thought I'd make everyone aware of the > options before someone like Wayne gets really irritated and starts sending > nasty notes :-) TAYL, Me? Irritated? I NEVER get irritated, dammit! :-) Seriously, at the time I wrote that note last year when I was the OBCAC chairman, we were starting to get a lot of offers and requests for what I considered "genuine UV", zircon-encrusted laminated holographic radioactive refractors. Lately, though, we have a very gray area to consider, which is the variety of really nice retro sets that have come out lately. Particularly the recent issues from Topps and Bowman (2001 and 2002 Heritage) and Fleer (2001 and 2002 Tradition). They feature current players on cards with the "look and feel" of the vintage cards we go nuts over. The card stock, photo style, even right down to the descriptions on the backs are really appealing. Unfortunately, we've locked ourselves into an absolute cutoff on the years we collect, which is just before the Topps/Fleer/Donruss competition and the "dark days" of mass production (the only thing in the universe more common than hydrogen atoms are 1988 Donruss cards). Friends of mine who really love old cars told me about their definition of "antique" which is any car over 25 years old (if I remember correctly, any car over 20 years old qualifies as a "classic"). That brings some concern to a few purists, who point out that the really crappy mid-1970's cars like the AMC Pacer, Gremlin, Ford Pinto, Dodge Dart, etc. are now all "antiques" (along with my 1972 Mercury Capri, may it rust in peace wherever it is). However, other vintage collectors and enthusiasts are perfectly happy admiring the "lines" and design of the 2001 Chrysler PT Cruiser, which looks more like an antique than cars which now qualify as antique. Even though we agree there's something twisted and horribly morally wrong about the genuine hardcore UV cards lately :-), not all very recent sets are visually offensive. Wayne Delia, WMDpks@aol.com Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College Narrator: "Fortunately, George had another trick up his sleeve." George of the Jungle (sheepishly): "George no have sleeves." ================= To: OBC-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 20:50:00 -0400 Subject: directory From: Bob Saxton Will whoever sent out the updated directory please shoot me another copy. My email program messed up and I didnt get all of it. GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/. ================= Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:26:27 EDT Subject: Change of e-mail address To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smart1853@aol.com Just letting it be known that I will be changing my e-mail address by the end of this week. My new e-mail/screename will be toppsrun368@aol.com. It works out great b/c I have had that SN for about a year, well before OBC. Originally it was created from Topps baseball cards and the fact that I am a runner. Now it can mean that along with outlining my future goal--the entire Topps run of baseball cards. I thought that was kind of neat. I am forced to change b/c of an increase in spam mail over the past week. I am getting between 200 and 300 e-mails on some days. Only a handful are OBC related or are from other important sources. Hopefully I will be up and running with my new e-mail and able to get OBC mail within the week. Brian Dwyer ================= Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 01:26:25 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Re: [OBC-Wantlist] 2002 Topps Heritage To: WMDpks@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com Wayne - Well said as always! However, let me play Devil's Advocate for a moment (I know some expected I would)! Is "visually offensive" really part of the point for our rules/guidelines on what the group normally collects? I don't think so, after all many "Mint" collectors would call many of our collections junk! I, for one, like the fact that I can pursue that rare old card at affordable prices because I am not concerned if it appears "visually offensive" to other collectors. I suspect that if we do away with some of the rules/guidelines many will not participate in the portion that deals with newer UV over produced cards even if they are not "visually offensive". I suppose in some respects that would be acceptable to many and I would probably accept it myself. I will confess I am a closet new card collector and will continue to pursue a full run of Mother's Cookies from 1952, 1953, and 1983 to 1999, Keeblers Cookies 2000 to present, Donruss Diamond Kings 1982 to present. In this pursuit I choose to look for these cards outside of OBC, just check my Ebay id "Tply" and you will find I have bids on a number of Mother's Cookies sets from the 1990's right now as I type. I also participate with a small group of OBCer's each year in buying boxes of Topps packs each year when they are available and I have even traded with this small group to complete the new sets. I will probably continue to do this as long as I feel we are not violating the guidelines/rules of this group. We do not use our traditional OBC email servers for these cards. The members that choose to collect cards produced after 1980 are free to do so and have ways of doing this without any change to the current rules/guidelines that have served us well for years. Lastly, I am not opposed to any change in the rules as long as we can agree to the changes by majority or committee and I will honor any decision made. Rest well my friends, Tripleplay (Rick) ================= Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 01:53:20 EDT Subject: Saint Al Visits Fremont (West) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com All - We had a "Saint Al" official visit today in Fremont, Ca.! Al and one his wonderful daughter's graced us with a visit today. It all started as I was working hard fighting crime and are evil when my cell phone played that familiar tune "Take Me Out to The Ball Game" which alerts me to an incoming call. The call came in around 11:30 AM and Al informed me he was close to Reno Nevada and only three to four hours away from the Bay Area. I told him to find 880 and travel north which would have put him back home in Seattle before it would my home! Lucky for Al I then called Margaret (she was home preparing for our big 4th of July Barbecue Party) and told her Al's cell phone number. Margaret called All immediately and corrected the direction I gave him! Those that know the history of Al's and Margaret's mishaps with directions in Vegas will find this hard to believe! I left work shortly after 4:00 PM only to arrive home a few minutes after Al had made all the right turns to arrive at my house! We had a wonderful visit (although it was to short) and even Al's attempts to persuade Margaret to get an annulment failed (I guess I still have her fooled). After visiting a talking for a short while we decided to treat Al and his daughter to dinner at a local "greasy spoon". After dinner Al proceeded by highway in a southern direction and hopefully some of the Southern California OBCer's should see him by tomorrow, no guarantees though, after all this is Al! Another Baseball Quote: "Sympathy is something that shouldn't be bestowed on the Yankees. Apparently it angers them" ------------Bob Feller Tripleplay (Rick) ================= To: , Subject: NATL. NEWS Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:22:06 -0500 From: "David Kolenda" Updated info on Natl. (07/04/2002) For those who have asked about hotels close to our house, I will send thatinfo early next week. There are a few (decent ones) within 5 - 10 Min. from the house. The drive on a Sat. Morning to the Natl. should be about 40 minutes. The list for the Natl and or the cookout continues to grow. A little under 5 weeks to go. Greg(YAZ) and Wade Conway will be in town starting on Friday. George Vrecheck (all ready in town) Steve Rittenberg arrives in town early in the week. In trying to echo what Ken said, ALL ARE WELCOME. Don't feel that just because you are new to the group or have not been to one of these crazy gatherings in the past that you should not come. COME, bring an appetite (Ken will), bring your wantlist for ALL SPORTS, ALLYEARS. I have boxes of dupes that will be available to go through. Even tho I do not collect much new stuff " I have a ton of it" Drop us a line if you think you will make it to the cookout and or the Natl. I have no concerns on the number showing up for the cookout. More is better. OBC Swap Session*** Here is the official info from Ken Place: Midway (Best Western) Hotel (1600 Oakton St., Elk Grove Village, IL) Date: Saturday Aug. 10th Time: 7PM (or right after the show lets out, whichever comes first) to midnight (but I think we might be able to stay a couple hours longer if Admission price: None! Recommended: Bring your dupes box, wantlist, and a willingness to accept a boatload of cardboard thrown at you from all directions to add to your collection ;-) Menu: Pizza and soda will be provided courtesy of our generous host Kevin Savage. I will find out his table number at the show, so you will be able to express your appreciation personally. No outside food allowed however. I'm guessing other menu items are available at room service prices - the hotel is catering, so the room is free. FRIDAY COOKOUT 10733 Manor Dr. St. John In. 219 365 7753 (home phone) 219 614 1651 (cell phone) (Saint) Al Cummings " will be there" staying across from the show, looking for a ride to cookout Gary Mandell " I plan to be there" Doug & Judy Smith "will try to be there" Doug has to be in Mich. on Sat. hopes to make the cookout on his way to Mich. Mike Wierzbicki "hopes to be there" James & Abbie Molta "Pencil in 2 and I will confirm " Tim Newcomb "hope to attend your cookout" Earl & Phyllis Kilbourn "I will probably be bringing my wife" Ken Morganti will be here for a week Kent Goto " I plan on attending your cookout." Joe Cerullo (ex OBCer) " arrives on Thurs." Mr. and Mrs. Ron Perry Ron has to work till 4 on Friday 3 our time. Will try and make it. Jim Hatch The state of NH will be checking in. Mike Hair OBC (Head Chef) (Comish) will arrive Thursday Night ================= Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 20:57:04 +0800 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Jeff Sackmann From: Lynn Miller I've done this before and I should have saved it. Actually I thought I did, but can't find it now. The email for Jeff in the directory doesn't work. I did get a working one from someone in the group and have corresponded with Jeff in the past few months. But now I don't have that better email address. Does someone else have it again. Thanks, Lynn ================= Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 21:00:16 +0800 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Jeff Sackmann From: Lynn Miller Belay my last (Navy talk for forget what I last said). I found it. Why would he make his address Jeffrey when everyone knows him as Jeff??? Thanks anyway, Lynn ================= Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:48:23 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Saint Al Visits Fremont (West) To: TPLY@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: GHAY1@aol.com Well, we have always known that Margaret can get people from Nevada to ================= To: Subject: Remember the Alamo... Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:25:42 -0700 From: "Geno Wagner" OBCers -- I've got to be in San Antonio for about three weeks from 15 Jul to 1 Aug with most nights and weekends free. I haven't looked down the Directory yet,but if anyone wants to get together that leaves reasonably close, I would love to get together and look for card shops! Take Care, Geno ================= Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:43:02 -0400 (EDT) To: dkolenda@surfnetinc.com (David Kolenda) Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] NATL. NEWS From: Originaleek@webtv.net I thought I saw an post once that mentioned the record for the largest gathering of OBCers. Might we threaten that record? Also, do we have to inform the local authorities of our gathering, you know like the Clan, Hells Angels & such? I think this group could be pretty formidable to an unsuspecting public. You may want to alert any neighborhood watch groups in the area. Just a thought! We keep what we give away! ================= Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2002 02:35:34 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Going on Vacation From: "kevin71058" Hi all, Just want to let the group know , I will be going on vacation as of tomorrow and I will be turning off my mail fuctions while I am away. Sorry, but I do not want to go through 600 emails when I come back Thanks for understanding, ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Interesting item on eBay web site item#1840332197: 15-1952 TOPPS CARDS+ MANTLE VERY POOR CARDS Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2002 06:21:02 PDT From: illini90@earthlink.net Anybody need a '52 Mantle and other stars for cheap? You need to check this one out! Take Care, Geno Title of item: 15-1952 TOPPS CARDS+ MANTLE VERY POOR CARDS Starts: Jun-28-02 20:41:51 PDT Ends: Jul-05-02 20:41:51 PDT Price: Currently $406.01 To bid on the item, go to: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1840332197 Item Description: "Cards were trimmed by someone to fit in an album".They were in a box I bought at a sale. Not sure if they are worth anything. 15-1952 TOPPS + mickey mantle baseball cards. Shipped in bubble mailer envelope. Shipping is $2.00 to USA & CANADA only. I accept paypal, billpoint, personal checks, int. money orders, & cash (only if you prefer). Good Luck Bidding! Thank You. On Jun-29-02 at 06:31:27 PDT, seller added the following information: Pay me securely with any major credit card through PayPal! function dw(nu){document.write(s1+"ppsl"+nu+".gif"+s2);} for(i=0;i=0){c1++;}else if((eval(f1+"["+i+"].search")).indexOf("BetterSeller")=0){c2++;}else if((eval(f1+"["+i+"].search")).indexOf("ListItemForSaleShow")=0){c3++;}else if((eval(f1+"["+i+"].hash")).indexOf("ListItemForSaleAutosShow")=0){c4++;}}} for(i=0;i0){s11=document.links[i].search;j=s11.indexOf(f13);if(j0){s11=s11.slice((j+(f13.length)));for(k=0;k=0){var p=new Array();p[0]=document.links[i].protocol;p[1]=document.links[i].hostname;p[2]=document.links[i].pathname;for(j=0;j ") On Jun-29-02 at 14:45:32 PDT, seller added the following information: Sorry, should read 16-1952 Topps cards which include 1 (one) Mickey Mantle. Again all the cards have been trimmed on sides, tops, & bottoms. Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com ================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com nerdmaker@naspa.net OCTraders@egroups.com vct-vintagecardtraders.com@lists.vintagecardtraders.com Subject: RE: [VCT] Ted Williams... Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:26:38 -0700 From: "jcollins12" I feel sad today not just for all Red Sox fans, but for all baseball fans everywhere. Ted was truly one of the greatest players of all time and one of my personal favorites. How ironic that as he died this morning, I am waiting on one of his cards in the mail right now, and the last two big trades I made both involved Ted. He may have been somewhat difficult and eccentric with the press and fans in his earlier years, but in the last several he had truly been an ambassador to baseball, making appearances and still doing his part to further the game even after age 80. I will never forget when he appeared at the '99 All-Star Game and World Series to be honored as part of the All-Century teams. I believe at the WS he tipped his hat again when they introduced him, flanked by Hank Aaron and Willie Mays who were both applauding. Truly a class act. Maybe some of you who actually remember Ted's playing days or saw him play can share some memories. Have a good weekend, >--- Original Message --- >From: Phil Chmielewski >To: OCTraders , VCT >Date: 7/5/02 1:11:08 PM >I'm sure many of you have heard about Ted Williams' passing >today. Here's a link to the NY Times slide show and article: >> Ted Williams Dies at 83 >> Ted Williams of the Boston Red Sox and baseball's last .400 >> hitter died today in Florida. >> Read the obituary, view a slide show and listen to New York >> Times sports columnist Dave Anderson's recollections of the >> "Splendid Splinter." >> Read More: http://www.nytimes.com/?8na >-- Check out the VCT website at: http://www.vintagecardtraders.com >-- Interested in your own VCT e-mail address? Let Dan know >-- E-mail the entire group at vct@lists.vintagecardtraders.com ================= Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:13:36 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] RE: [VCT] Ted Williams... To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: friar4@aol.com Ted played in the first MLB game I ever saw. I was 13 years old and it was July (I think) of 1958. The game was against the Washington Senators. Ted hit a homerun into the right field bleachers at Fenway early in the game. Must have gone about a third of the way up the bleachers. I didn't think all that much of it at the time, thinking that was probably normal. Those of you who watch games regularly at Fenway might want to think about how often we see a shot that far these days. I can't remember many - if any. The Sox were losing 5-3 in the bottom of the ninth and had two men on. You can guess who was up with two outs. Ted hit another towering shot to deep right to the right of the bull pens. Like most of his shots, it seemed as high as it was deep. Everybody held their breath as Senators' right fielder Faye Throneberry(Marv's brother) went back to the fence. Up went his gloved hand and everybody saw the ball come down, wondering if it had fallen into his glove or over the fence to win the game. Alas, he pulled the glove down, picked out the ball, threw it in, and started to trot toward the dugout. Teddy Ballgame (I love that nickname - I believe given to him by sports columnist John Gillooly) had just missed on that one. He didn't miss many. Rest in peace, Ted. Friar - 44 years later ================= Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:37:03 EDT Subject: the most "important" man in baseball To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- Tim told me a story about his early card collecting days and Williams i would like to share- Of course Tim is a Yankee fan like me and he sought every Mantle card he could get as a kid- But he remembers many older boys telling him Ted Williams is the most "important " man in baseball because there are more cards of him than any other player- that's because of those 59 Fleer cards- Tim told me he believed Williams had to be the most important player because a lot of older kids had 50 or 60 cards of just that one player- he asked kids why those baseballs greatest cards only had 1 player - Williams- why no Mantle- kids replied because Williams had to be baseball's greatest player- Linda ================= Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 16:55:50 EDT Subject: Re: topps heritage 2002 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: dsh46@aol.com well, i'll admit it too...i am collecting this set (and will also go after the 2001). i needed something to keep me busy when my son goes looking for cards (flea market type card shows, all uv) and this set is great for that. ================= Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2002 22:28:18 -0400 Subject: 1968 Mets To: chicolini1@aol.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Mark S Talbot Hi Sal and other Mets fans, I just had my brother-in-law Mike in from North Carolina and he wanted to show me his newly acquired Nolan Ryan RC. So I asked him what do you plan to do with it, he thought it over and after looking at some of my stuff he decided to begin collecting the `68 Mets team set. So I pulled 15 cards and gave them to him. Now my question. Where can I find a listing of Mets (or any team) team cards in particular - one for the `68 set? Do you have a source? Do you know someone who does? LMK if you could as Mike will be leaving Michigan tomorrow. BE REGARDS --------------------------------- MARK "Live long and prosper" - Spock * Mark S. Talbot * * 34030 Chatsworth Drive * * Sterling Heights, MI. * * 48312-4604 * * talbot1@comcast.net * ================= Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 23:57:28 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] 1968 Mets To: talbot1@comcast.net, Chicolini1@aol.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com The following is the 1968 Topps Mets Team checklist from my source "The Sport Americana Team Baseball Card Checklist": 27 Gil Hodges (M) 45 Tom Seaver 63 Dick Kenworthy 92 Ed Kranepool 114 Ron Swoboda 132 Bud Harrelson 177 Nolan Ryan (R) 191 Dan Frisella 211 J.C. Martin 236 Tug McGraw 254 Cleon Jones 277 Jerry Buchek 292 Art Shamsky 313 Al Weis 345 Bob Hendley 386 Greg Goosesen 401 Team Card 421 Ron Taylor 437 Don Cardwell 465 Tommie Agee 486 Cal Koonce 503 Al Jackson 521 Don Shaw 536 Bill Short 556 Dick Selma 563 Ed Charles 569 Less Rohr (R) 572 Don Bosch 582 Jerry Grote 594 Phil Linz Good Luck and Happy Collecting! Tripleplay (Rick) ================= To: , Subject: Fw: The Natl. Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 06:12:13 -0500 From: "David Kolenda" Below is a note from Sal. If anyone has info on a decent priced place or maybe looking for a roomy for the Natl.drop him a line. ----- Original Message ----- From: ChicoD1@aol.com To: DKolenda@surfnetinc.com Sent: Saturday, July 06, 2002 12:16 AM Subject: Re: The Natl. Looks pretty good. I still need to find a hotel near O'hare. Only thing isit looks like I'm going from Wed to Sat (Playoffs start on that Sunday), so I'll miss the Sat nite activities. As soon as I find a place to haul my cards to at nite, I'm booking the flight. Got any ideas of hotels close to the airport that aren't heavy in the pocket (I want to save as much as possible for cardboard ). ================= Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 09:49:15 EDT Subject: an amazing statistic To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Traderdoug@aol.com In all the articles about Ted Williams one number stood out to me. 93.6% voted him into the Hall of Fame on the first ballot. Whats amazing to me is how dumb 6.4% of those voting can be. Just a thought. - Doug ================= Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 11:36:41 EDT Subject: Ted Williams HOF vote To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Wite3@aol.com Actually Doug, I am surprised at how high that is...Williams was the Barry Bonds of his day. He often alienated the press and blasted writers and reporters at will...i am surprised he was not down near 80%. ================= Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 14:12:06 EDT Subject: "Huge Collection" Pictures Rationale To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- i recently got an e-mail alerting me to a huge card collection on ebay by the seller- the ebay # is 1840849078-What i don't understand is the choice of pics the seller included with this massive lot- Wouldn't you want to picture the best cards if you were the seller??How come if there is a 52 Mantle in this lot the seller doesn't have it pictured and the card he prominately pictures is a 82 Donrus Ripkin???Read what is in this lot and remember his starting bid is over $9,700!!!-(Jim Montgomery where are you when we need you!)- the seller says there are over 250 52 topps in this lot.Just don't understand why if you have a 52 Mantle in a lot for sale you would have a big pic of an 82 Ripkin card like it is the featured card- sellers name is skypreston- maybe he has had his head up in the clouds or "sky" too much- Linda ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" , Subject: dream card Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 15:05:43 -0400 From: "John Collins" My dream card finally showed up today, courtesy of an ebay transaction. 1941 Playball #14, "Ted" Williams. I could not stop thinking how ironic itwas yesterday that as we lost Ted, he was still thrilling me because I waswaiting for this card in the mail. This Ted is only Good (an SGC 30) but he is wonderful none the less. I might add that this is also the only card graded "good" that I've ever seen that doesn't have any creases. If only this one could talk. It would probably tell stories of how some kid loved it during the summer of '41 as he watched Ted go down the stretch shooting for .400 !! May Ted rest in peace....have a good weekend everybody !! John C. Collins ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Interesting item on eBay web site item#1840715357: 1955 Topps SANDY KOUFAX Rookie #123 - Dodgers Date: Sat, 06 Jul 2002 21:31:21 PDT From: illini90@earthlink.net If anybody needs a 1955 Koufax RC, here's a cheap one...although it's actually "ndy" Koufax! Title of item: 1955 Topps SANDY KOUFAX Rookie #123 - Dodgers Starts: Jun-30-02 18:57:32 PDT Ends: Jul-07-02 18:57:32 PDT Price: Currently $25.80 To bid on the item, go to: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1840715357 Item Description: This 1955 Topps Sandy Koufax rookie is in poor shape - it is missing part of the left and bottom and looks trimmed on the right side too - good card to be used as a filler for a collector grade set until an upgrade can be found (see scan below ). Winner pays $2.00 shipping. Winners of multiple items in my auctions ending tonight will pay shipping on one item only. Payments by money order, check, or use your credit card on www.paypal.com. Please do not use ebays checkout - you will receive an auto email on where to send payment. Be sure to see my other auctions on Ebay On Jul-01-02 at 11:34:14 PDT, seller added the following information: Pay me securely with any major credit card through PayPal! function dw(nu){document.write(s1+"ppslv"+nu+".gif"+s2);} for(i=0;i=0){c1++;}else if((eval(f1+"["+i+"].search")).indexOf("BetterSeller")=0){c2++;}else if((eval(f1+"["+i+"].search")).indexOf("ListItemForSaleShow")=0){c3++;}else if((eval(f1+"["+i+"].hash")).indexOf("ListItemForSaleAutosShow")=0){c4++;}}} for(i=0;i0){s11=document.links[i].search;j=s11.indexOf(f13);if(j0){s11=s11.slice((j+(f13.length)));for(k=0;k=0){var p=new Array();p[0]=document.links[i].protocol;p[1]=document.links[i].hostname;p[2]=document.links[i].pathname;for(j=0;j ") Visit eBay, The World's Online Marketplace TM at http://www.ebay.com ================= Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 14:13:30 EDT Subject: Dealers who only buy from "authorized distributors" -not the public To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- i have noticed a recent trend in who dealers in card shops buy from and i wonder if other OBCer's in their area have noticed this trend- the cause of it seems to be dealer's overstocked inventories and a general slow down in card buying- the trend is dealers in card shops won't buy cards from customers who come in to sell cards-Tim went to a card shop yesterday and noticed a guy with a shoebox crammed with cards he wanted to sell- the cards were all 65 to 71 topps and were the man's childhood collection - untouched in a shoe box and stored in a closet since 1971- the top of the cards in the shoebox were covered in dust and spider webbing-when the guy approached the shop owner to sell the cards he received a reply something like " sorry i can't make an offer for those cards as i am overstocked now and can't sell what i have and i only am buying right now from authorized distributors of major product like Upper Deck and Topps"--Tim of course followed the guy out of the shop to make an offer on the cards being the shark smelling blood that he is recognizing the guy really needed money. And of course he offered the guy 1 cent each for the cards which he proceeded to tell the guy were basically worthless because of creases and wear and after all the store owner refused to buy them- So Tim ended up purchasing a shoe box crammed with about 800 cards from 1965 to 1971 for $8-- 781 to be exact- ( Tim later complained to me he overpaid the guy by 19 cents for the box)- but i immediately looked in the box and noticed a 66 Koufax, a 66 Rose , 2 1966 Clementes- 1 EX without creases and centered- Yes, the Koufax and Rose were creased as a lot of the cards in the box were but that 1 1966 EX Clemente is sure worth more than $8- the facinating thing was to see this shoe box full of cards untouched and undisturbed for over 30 years stored in a closet- they are cards that came directly out of packs and were obviously played with and handled- but just as they were- a kid's childhood collection stored in a shoe box for 31 years in a closet- Also i noticed the guy told Tim he was a Phillies fan as the cards are arranged by team in the shoe box with even home made cardboard dividers AND home made cards made up of Phillies players- There are a few cards that are black and white pics cut from possibly a year book and pasted to cardboard with name and stats pasted on the back- i am curious about this- Did anyone else do this as a kid- make their own cards by pasting pics of players and stats from a yearbook onto a piece of card board the size of a standard card? One of these home made cards is of Phillie Frederick Wenz- (# 32 is in the upper left hand corner of the back of the card with the players name and year by year stats)- the front of the card shows a pasted on B&W photo of the player- card is from 1970 because last years stats on the card are from 1969- Louisville-also it is interesting to notice how few hi# cards there are in this shoe box of a kid's 60's collection- i am trying to keep the cards intact and in order in this shoe box -a kid's childhood collection untouched for 31 years- i would be happy to show any visiting OBCer this box- it has to bring back memories with the homemade cardboard dividers with the teams names and especially the "homemade" Phillies cards-(Darn - the cards the kid had the fewest of are Yankees- Well, what do you expect from a Phillies fan!) -the shoe box says "Hush Timers by Hill" and there is a price tag still on the box of $3.60= i think a find of a kid's untouched for 31 years shoe box collection is a great find- Linda ================= Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 14:27:41 EDT Subject: Bowman collectors To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com, vct@yahoogroups.com From: jdelott@aol.com I went to a show today, and found a dealer who is selling 1951 hi-series Bowman cards which have been cut. He has 24 cards which he is willing to sell for $8.00. If anyone is interested, just let me know. ================= Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 14:30:39 EDT Subject: Special collectors To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jdelott@aol.com At a show today I picked up a Johnny Callison and some Pilot cards because I recalled we had some members specializing in collecting those cards. Please email me and I will forward them. ================= Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 15:02:26 EDT Subject: Tripleplay's Dupes Box Available 7/7/2002 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com All - Please don't be shy, this is my dupes box available as of 7/7/2002: TRIPS DUPES BOX AVAILABLE 7/7/2002 BASEBALL DUPES ***IMAGES AVAILABLE UPON REQUEST*** 1953 BOWMAN COLOR 16, 66 1955 TOPPS 81, 90 1959 TOPPS 75, 319, 332, 342, 422 1960 LEAF 68, 69 1961 TOPPS 1962 TOPPS 1963 TOPPS 1966 TOPPS 5, 21, 33, 43, 49, 84, 96, 123, 189 1967 TOPPS 29, 62, 87, 114, 147, 148, 172, 176, 189, 193, 212, 213, 214, 231, 267 1968 TOPPS 296 (3), 352 (2), 354, 357 (2), 358, 389 (2) 1969 TOPPS 19, 23, 38 1970 TOPPS 4, 6, 13, 19 (2), 23, 35, 37, 38, 43, 44, 54, 57, 79, 80, 91 (2), 92 (2), 93 (2), 103, 108, 111, 112, 113 (2), 124, 126, 127 (2), 131 (2), 132 (2), 266 (3), 268 (3), 274 (2), 277, 278 (4), 297, 322, 324, 334, 354 (2), 361 (2), 366, 374, 392 (3), 393 (2) 673 1971 TOPPS 2, 3 (2), 10, 11, 12, 18, 27, 28, 41, 42 (2), 51, 52 (2), 57, 59 (2), 60, 73 (2), 77, 84, 89, 91, 102, 103, 105, 108 (2), 109, 110 (4), 113 (2), 114, 120, 121, 124, 125, 128, 131, 132, 163, 223, 239, 240 (2) 1972 TOPPS 3, 7, 9, 11, 15, 17, 18, 19, 22, 24, 30, 35, 39 (3), 40, 43, 45, 53, 55, 56, 57 (2), 58 (3), 60, 62, 63, 65, 66, 68, 73 (3), 76, 77, 78 (2), 81, 97, 98 (2), 99 (3), 109, 110, 111, 115 (2), 118 (3), 119, 122, 124, 126, 129, 149 (2), 199 (2), 207 (3), 214, 231, 238 (4), 242 (6), 295, 374 1973 TOPPS 11, 27, 40 (2), 96, 101, 118 (2), 161, 197, 211, 236, 290 1974 TOPPS 8 (5), 59, 67, 71, 76, 99, 172, 189, 213 (3), 228, 233, 249, 256, 284, 294 (2), 295, 328, 335, 354 (3), 370, 405, 406, 442, 447, 466 (2), 467, 482, 492, 493, 498, 506, 539 (2) 1974 TOPPS TRADED 43T, 51T (3), 62T (2), 63T (2), 73T, 139T (2), 151T, 165T, 175T, 186T (6), 270T, 313T, 373T, 428T, 348T, 486T (2), 496T, 579T (2), 616T (2), 649T 1975 TOPPS 11, 31, 37, 54, 78 (2), 107, 147, 162, 316 (2), 323, 326 (2), 327, 330, 332, 347, 353, 366, 424, 464, 467 (2), 468, 486, 495, 536, 626, 633 1976 TOPPS 26 (2), 27 (2), 30, 33 (3), 37 (2), 52, 57, 110 (4), 112, 113, 116 (2), 122, 136 (2), 148, 153, 155 (3), 162 (2), 164 (2), 171 (5), 181 (2), 182 (2), 186 (2), 212 (6), 214, 221, 224 (4), 225, 231 (3), 232, 238 (3), 245, 247, 256 (7), 263, 269, 271, 272, 273, 281, 282 (2), 283 (3), 287 (3), 296, 297 (2), 298 (4), 301, 302 (5), 306 (2), 309 (2), 311, 312 (5), 320, 322, 327, 328, 332, 333, 334, 338, 352, 356, 364 (2), 383, 397, 398, 401, 403 (2), 404, 409, 410, 413, 424, 428, 439, 446, 447, 478, 479, 484, 491, 492, 497 (2), 503, 509, 514, 516, 521 (2), 524, 536 (2), 544, 555, 571, 572 (4), 576 (4), 577 (2), 584, 602, 608, 615, 627, 629, 630, 645, 648, 651, 652 (2) 1976 TOPPS TRADED 27T (19), 28t, 44T (12), 58T, 85T, 99T, 120T (12), 127T (14), 146T (15), 158T (16), 208T (19), 211T (14), 231T (16), 250T, 259T (10), 292T (11), 29 (15), 309T (17), 338T (11), 383T (14), 385T (14), 401T (17), 410T (14), 411 (17), 428T (10), 434T (15), 464T (18), 497T (15), 524T (17), 527T (14), 528T (16), 532T (15), 554T (10), 579T (13), 583T (15), 618T (14), 632T (17), 649T (17) CHECKLIST NO NUMBER (11) 1977 TOPPS 91, 97 (2), 195 (2), 200, 275, 342, 408, 454, 511 1978 TOPPS 16, 24, 25, 29 (6), 32, 37, 38 (2), 43 (2), 47 (2), 51 (3), 53 (3), 56, 61, 64 (2), 67 (5), 68 (5), 77 (3), 78 (4), 79, 85 (3), 93 (6), 102 (2), 106, 109, 132, 135 (3), 147, 154 (3), 157 (3), 170, 177 (2), 186 (2), 187 (6), 190, 191, 194 (2), 197, 202 4 (2), 204 (3), 207 (3), 211 (4), 212, 216 (2), 217 (2), 219 (2), 221 (2), 224 (3), 225 (3), 228, 236, 242 (4), 246 (3), 247, 248 (5), 249 (2), 252 (2), 260 (2), 261 (3), 263, 265 (6), 266 (2), 268 (2), 269, 271 (2), 272, 273 (3), 276 (3), 281 (2), 284, 285 (4), 286, 290 (3), 296 (2), 297 (3), 298, 299, 306 (4), 307, 308 (2), 311 (5), 316, 322 (2), 323 (2), 326 (7), 327 (6), 330, 342 (2), 343 (5), 349 (4), 353, 354 (4), 364, 365, 366 (3), 372, 377 (2), 378, 384 (2), 388 (4), 389, 394, 396 (2), 401 (2), 403, 406 (4), 414 (3), 417, 425 (3), 428, 430, 436 (7), 437 (3), 438, 441 (2), 443, 445, 449 (4), 458 (2), 459, 461(4), 462, 472 (4), 475, 477 (2), 483, 486, 487 (5), 488, 496 (4), 497, 502 (2), 504, 507, 509, 511 (2), 518, 527 (2), 538 (3), 539, 543 (2), 544 (2), 548 (5), 552, 554 (3), 555, 556, 557 (2), 559, 561 (6), 562, 576 (2), 578, 579, 581, 585 (2), 587 (2), 592, 604 (2), 611, 615, 617 (2), 619 (2), 621, 622 (2), 623, 624 (2), 625 (2), 626, 627, 632 (2), 633, 634, 636, 638, 641 (3), 646 (5), 647, 650, 657 (2), 658 (3), 662 (3), 669, 679, 686, 692, 693, 699, 702, 703 (7), 711, 712, 724, 726 1979 TOPPS 1 (2), 4, 23, 29, 39, 51 (2), 54 (9), 63 (2), 67 (2), 77, 78, 85, 97, 104 (2), 130 (2), 137, 154 (5), 179, 241, 243 (2), 247 (6), 279, 303 (6), 327 (3),356, 405, 406, 408 (3), 418 (9), 429 (2), 455 (2), 461 (3), 468 (3), 470 (2), 528 (4), 531, 564, 580, 605 (15), 642 (3), 645 (3), 653 (5), 670 (2), 671 (3), 676, 683 (6), 684 (2), 686 (4), 691 (6), 710 (2) 1980 TOPPS 12 (36), 15 (7), 16 (2), 32, 34 (37), 35 (3), 36 (3), 47, 51 (6), 68, 72 (5), 76, 84 (2), 87 (2), 93 (3), 102 (5), 114 (3), 138, 142, 145 (3), 158 (50), 174 (4), 179 (3), 183 (11), 184 (2), 211 (7), 246 (2), 255 (8), 263 (2), 264 (4), 271, 284 (41), 286, 314, 317 (3), 325 (3), 327 (5), 355, 373 (5), 379 (3), 387 (4), 390, 394, 397, 399 (5), 412, 418 (4), 430 (9), 459 (2), 462 (34), 469, 471 (2), 486 (3), 489 (5), 491 (3), 494, 502 (7), 504 (3), 513, 527 (13), 530 (3), 538, 541 (2), 549 (4), 558 (3), 566 (3), 572 (10), 585 (2), 586, 589, 597, 603 (5), 611, 614 (2), 618 (3), 621, 623 (2), 627, 632, 634, 642 (2), 654, 657, 665 (2), 666 (2), 675 (2), 678 (3), 687 (5), 692, 695, 711, 714, 717 (44) FOOTBALL DUPES: 1, 2, 3, 5 (2), 9, 16, 23, 24, 25, 26, 32, 33, 44, 45, 47, 48, 50, 53, 54, 59, 64, 75, 76, 82, 87, 92, 94, 115, 118, 130, 149, 178, 223 1973 TOPPS 1976 TOPPS 21 (2), 32, 36, 37, 43 (2), 57, 79, 81, 112, 163, 165 (3), 189 (2), 263 (2), 276, 279, 280, 292 (2), 293 (2), 367 1977 TOPPS 25, 141, 157, 174, 200, 239, 246, 270, 275, 315, 336, 345, 412, 468, 525 1978 TOPPS 102, 122, 210, 251, 323, 347, 498 1979 TOPPS 68, 235, 490, 503, 505, 511, 512, 516, 526 ================= Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 18:00:07 EDT Subject: Yet Another Baseball Quote To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com OBC - I am sure many of you have seen this quote before, it seems appropriate to repeat now: "In 1955 there were 77,263,127 male American human beings. And every one of them....would have given two arms, a leg and his collection of Davy Crockett iron-ons to be Teddy Ballgame." ---------Brendan C. Boyd and Fred C. Harris on Ted Williams, The great American Baseball Card Flipping, Trading and Bubble Gum Book Tripleplay (Rick) ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" Subject: Freeze the Splinter? Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 21:09:21 -0400 From: "John Collins" Does anyone know if there is any truth behind the rumors that Ted Williams'son John-Henry has had a Florida Cryonics company freeze his body (or at least his head) in hopes of supposedly reviving him sometime years in the future or to sell his DNA? I hope the rumors aren't true, but it appears they are, as reputable news sources are reporting this story everywhere. What a shame for the rest of his John C. Collins ================= Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 21:35:30 +0800 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: [Fwd: Rick is home] From: Lynn Miller Hi Gang, This is great news. But apparently Rick still has a long, long way to go. Let's get that OBC therapy to him as soon as we can. I just sent him a package a few days ago of the remaining "Bubbas" he needed. Al and Neal are taking care of the big ones. Lynn ================= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:00:15 EDT Subject: Re: Freezing Ted To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: cardclctor@aol.com In a message dated 7/8/02 5:44:00 AM, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com writes: << Does anyone know if there is any truth behind the rumors that Ted Williams' son John-Henry has had a Florida Cryonics company freeze his body (or at least his head) in hopes of supposedly reviving him sometime years in the future or to sell his DNA? I hope the rumors aren't true, but it appears they are, as reputable news sources are reporting this story everywhere. What a shame for the rest of his family. >> This whole story completely disgusts me. The news around here is that the younger Williams' sister has filed an injunction to prohibit John Henry from freezing his dad's body. I find this totally in line with John Henry's thinking though. He's lived his entire life profiting from the popularity of his dad, so why should the death of his cash cow stop him? The next day he does something of his own merit will be the first. I think he should be stopped from preserving the DNA just on the fact that there might be another person who turns out like John Henry! My only hope is that he spends every penny he ever made off his father fighting this. TAYL, Ken M ================= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:24:12 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Re: Freezing Ted To: CardClctor@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: mma3026559@aol.com Its absolutely disgusting what John Henry is doing. After listening to his father a number of years ago on 60 Minutes talk about the hoards of fraudulant signatures in the hobby (especially his) & how he & John Henry were the only ones who could distinguish the good from bad, but failing to mention the fact that he & John Henry were charging a significant premium over market if you bought their 'authenticated' wares, I lost a lot of respect for Ted. Perhaps that was a misguided loss of respect & it more deservingly belongs to his son, who clearly has limited , if any moral values, questionable ethics, and in listening to his half-sister, a complete lack of respect for his father, beyond the financial windfall he feels he was born into & deserves. Its short-sighted, greedy, disgusting creatures like him that give Americans a bad name / reputation throughout the world...... ================= Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 17:30:14 -0700 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: road trip From: This is a long one so save until you have an hour or so. Can you say I might have mentioned I had a week off and was headed to Reno and Cal. We left early Sat. a week ago. First stop was in Lacey, WA to hook up with Dave Fallen. He brought his wife and we ate lunch. He hands me a pile of cards and I give him a cap. After some good food and long chat I head south after Dave adds a donation to the Rick attack Fund. Big Thanks Dave. Next stop was Eugene, OR to meet Brian Lindholme. WE meet at the Mall near my Motel. Brian brings the whole family. I have met the kids before but I met his better half this time. WE eat chat and search the mall. Brian insists I take some cards from his dupes and I have no list so we decide on the half that does not includes the 77 topps. I get a cards and we both chime in at the same time "Peter" as it is a 52 Topps horizontal. The rest were tucked away safely with the UV packs the mall offered. We spend the night and get up early for the drive to Reno. Get there with no suprises and hit the machines. Michelle does good the first night and I suffer through 2 days with no luck. Second day we meet a member of another list and sit and chat with him for a while. Third day my luck turns and I win a little back but still wind up down for the trip. We head west to Fremont and Casa Ellison. I call Rick for a plan and directions and he sends me to who knows where? Good thing Maragret calls and give better directions. I drive up in plenty of time time Rick won't be home until 6 pm. Maragret shows Michelle the wedding photos, I still can't bear looking at the sad event. Rick comes home and starts to entertain us with his vast knowledge and personality. He tries to give me an old newspaper with some old local player but I am reluctant to take something I would have to take home and burn. We head out for dinner at a local family place and we again are happy to listen to Rick talk. Food and good friends are the best but had to end so we can head south. We stay the night near Camp Roberts and in the morning finish the drive to LA. The coast was foggy but the day turned nice when we got close to Northridge. We spend a few hours driving around before we found a motel and call the local folks. A couple hours later Peter calls and says we can come over later for dinner. We are waiting around in the room when Tim Fitak calls and invites us to his house. I head over there and drive right to the place but pass the house as they all like to hide the numbers and I had forgotten the list anyway. About 5 houses later I see someone in the rearview mirror waving so I pull a U-turn and pull into Tim and Linda's driveway. I don't even get out of my car before I am given the customary 52 Topps card that rewards all visitors. I give Tim a OBC cap and go in to meet Linda and see the grand collection. I hope you all can meet Tim and Linda some day as they are true collectors. Linda is beautiful, very smart, talented and modest. I saw her artwork, she sings, writes for magazines and preforms on stage. Tim is a wiz at cards, knows the short prints, condition variations and also is great at puzzles and video games. He is doing very well at recovering from his health problems and would be glad to help you with your want list questions. We starting talking about Rick and he dug out cards from various piles and from his own collection to give to the cause. Next time you see Linda ask her what the phone number to the motel is. I could not remember between the time I looked at the book and dialed. She still knew it 3 hours later. After a while we all headed to Peter's place to see him and eat dinner. Peter and Denise are two of my best friends in OBC and very special people. Their jobs keep them very busy but when you are with them they just make you feel like you are the only thing on thier mind. Peter had the BBQ going and Denise was working in the kitchen. Burgers, chicken and sausages along with salad and home-made steak fries. Yummy!! More then enough to feed us all. After dinner more talk and a view or Peter's collections. Sometime, Linda and Tim slipped out and brought back dessert along with a special card for Peter. We also listened to Peter's famous Van Lingo Mungo song and other baseball songs. About MIdnight we called it a night and Peter give me the the coolest gift I think I have gotten from OBC. It ranks right up there with the Nolan Ryan book Lynn Miller sent. It was an original script from Star Trek: The next Generation. Not sure where they got it, "just something sitting in the garage" The book was in perfect shape and like no one ever used it. I love it! We hung out in LA Friday, hit the mall and hung out trying to stay cool. Saturday we headed north and stopped in Oregon that night. Sunday we hit the rain and once we got to Washington there was traffic. 4 big slowdowns and 2 major accidents slowed a 3 hour trip to almost 6 hours. I was GLAD to get home and slept like a baby. Back to work Monday(today). Great fun, good trip. Nice to be away from the computer for a week and kind of away from cards but tons of mail to read and more work then ever to catch up on. More on the Rick attack and all in the next letter. You may now delete this dribble Big Al back in Seattle ================= To: , Subject: Re: [OBC-National] White Sox game at the National Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:44:09 -0500 From: "David Kolenda" Should not be a problem getting tickets mid week, or any other time. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jrhatchjr@aol.com To: OBC-National@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, July 07, 2002 3:50 PM Subject: [OBC-National] White Sox game at the National Coming back from vacation, I saw some messages regarding a Friday game atthe National. Of course, I'm going to David's cookout on Friday, but am wondering if there's any interest in a game on Wednesday or Thursday (vs Angels). I'm just putting out a feeler at this point. I'd have to assume by seeing some pictures on TV that we'd be able to walk up at game time and get tix, especially mid-week. Someone in the area please correct me if I'm wrong. One month to go... Happy Collecting! To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:06:08 EDT Subject: How should I handle? To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com From: "Mark Nelson" To: Subject: RE: Notification of an Instant Purchase Payment Received Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 14:08:12 -0500 There were no creases on the card prior to shipping. As I am not a card grader myself, the differentiation between excellent and very good is miniscule as it is, that is why I included a picture for inspection. Sorry, no refunds. -----Original Message----- From: Brockhattox@cs.com [mailto:Brockhattox@cs.com] Sent: Monday, July 08, 2002 2:00 PM To: tysn2391@csd.uwm.edu Subject: Re: Notification of an Instant Purchase Payment Received I received the card today. It is not in EX condition as you said in your eBay description. It has a crease from the Dodger logo to the bottom of the card. The two bottom corners are rounded. The best it could be called is G-VG. Would you like for me to return the card? If so, Please return my money via PayPal. I would be willing to keep the card, if you return $20 of the payment price. Please let me know what you would like to Brock Hattox "ecru" on eBay ================= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:14:33 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] How should I handle? To: Brockhattox@cs.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: amcook93@aol.com Brock, I just looked at the posting and I agree with you. Not only is the picture far too small to expect someone to be able to detect any creases on the card's surface, but scanning it in a screwdown holder also can hide blemishes. Possibly, this seller did not detect the creases because he didn't take the card out of the holder...it's possible. In any case, he should refund your money. If he leaves you negative feedback I believe that you can reply and state he misrepresented his merchandise and was unreasonable about it. You can also state that in your feedback to him. ================= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:35:43 EDT Subject: any 1 interested in trading a 69 mantle for a 68 mantle? To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Celenox@aol.com Hello I have a 68 topps mantle i am looking to trade for a 69 topps mantle can anyone help? ================= Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:47:14 EDT Subject: re: how should I handle To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Traderdoug@aol.com Brock - You could leave a negative, but its clear he didn;t leave a positive for you after prompt payment so he'll likewise leave a negative for you. Letting the rest of us know not to deal with him is a good start. - doug ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 06:08:52 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Rick's New Updated 1955 list--HUGE STRIDES! From: Neal Thomas Hi all- With incoming cards from a few OBCers en route, including a Clemente Rookie Card, we are getting down to the nitty-gritty of Rick's 1955 set. We now have only 10 cards left, including a few biggies (but nothing as big as the Clemente), so I think we can knock this off. I have started school again this summer, so my card time for my own set is minimal, but I would like to finish Rick's set in the near future. If anyone has any of the last ten cards that Rick needs available, please let me know. Thanks, 050 (Robinson) 155 (Matthews) 161 (Tanner) 187 (Hodges) 189 (Rizzuto) 190 (Woodling) 195 (Roebuck) (10 left) ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:22:16 -0400 (EDT) To: dkolenda@surfnetinc.com (David Kolenda) Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] NATL. NEWS From: Originaleek@webtv.net Recent events and future circumstances may preclude my attendance at the National. I will know more the latter part of next week. We keep what we give away! ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:46:34 EDT Subject: More from Mark Nelson To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com From: "Mark Nelson" To: Subject: RE: Notification of an Instant Purchase Payment Received Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:05:31 -0500 The card was described accurately, don't try to accuse me of pulling some kind of stunt. You had a picture to judge for yourself, at that point you could have e-mailed for a further description or more pics. Hence, it's your own fault. Sorry, that's the reality. Since you don't seem to understand, further e-mails will be deleted, you can leave any type of feedback you wish. -----Original Message----- From: Brockhattox@cs.com [mailto:Brockhattox@cs.com] Sent: Monday, July 08, 2002 9:30 PM To: tysn2391@uwm.edu Subject: Re: Notification of an Instant Purchase Payment Received Please take a look at eBay auction #1831763317. If you had described your card accurately in terms of creases, you should have gotten a winning bid at about this level. ================= To: , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:11:31 -0500 From: "tim newcomb" Brock, He's probably blocked your emails from now on, so I'd say get on with your life. What's his ebay username again? This brings up a question I've wondered about from time to time. We're all telling ourselves now that we won't deal with Brock's guy, but after a few months it's easy to forget these things. Should there be, somewhere on the OBC website, a permanent list where members can flag sellers they recommend staying away from? This would need to be a place accessible only to members, like the biographies. The list would need to be accompanied by a member's short narrative of his or her experience with the person, so that other members could evaluate the problems. There would be cases where some in the group had had unproblematic or pleasant dealings with the person, and they could weigh in with their more positive comments, so we'd develop a balanced group of perspectives on prominent sellers. This wouldn't claim to be a systematic judgment on dealers, but it would give us a reservoir of information as we went forward with a transaction. And it would flag total losers like Mark Nelson-- What does the OBCAC think about this? ----- Original Message ----- From: To: < > Sent: Tuesday, July 09, 2002 6:46 AM Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > OBC-Ramblings-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 18:07:38 EDT Subject: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson To: tysn2391@csd.uwm.edu From: Traderdoug@aol.com To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:46:34 EDT Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson From: "Mark Nelson" To: Subject: RE: Notification of an Instant Purchase Payment Received Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:05:31 -0500 The card was described accurately, don't try to accuse me of pulling some kind of stunt. You had a picture to judge for yourself, at that point you could have e-mailed for a further description or more pics. Hence, it's your own fault. Sorry, that's the reality. Since you don't seem to understand, further e-mails will be deleted, you can leave any type of feedback you wish. -----Original Message----- From: Brockhattox@cs.com [mailto:Brockhattox@cs.com] Sent: Monday, July 08, 2002 9:30 PM To: tysn2391@uwm.edu Subject: Re: Notification of an Instant Purchase Payment Received Please take a look at eBay auction #1831763317. If you had described your card accurately in terms of creases, you should have gotten a winning bid at about this level. ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 18:39:12 EDT Subject: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com I appreciate the effort of Doug to influence this seller, but let's just let it go. He obviously has no intention of making this right and could care less about his reputation. I am going to let a week or so pass and then leave negative feedback. In a message dated 7/9/2002 6:34:20 PM Eastern Daylight Time, tysn2391@uwm.edu writes: > Excuse me?? My attitude is just fine, I wasn't the one who tossed > accusations > around from the get go. I frankly don't care how "respected" anyone is from > others. I base things off personal experience. > Furthermore, I didn't give you permission to e-mail me, consider this a > warning. Per e-commerce laws in WI, further e-mails will constitute > harassment. Check user "speedymccr" on Ebay if you think I'm joking, and > look > up his record under in Milwaukee County Circuit Court. > As far as posting messages in some newsgroup, go for it!! The card was > listed > with a brief description along with a picture of the front and back of the > card. If there were further questions, I could have been e-mailed prior to > bidding. > Anyoine with sense will see who the crybaby is here. > No refunds!! Got it??? > Again, any further e-mails regarding this situation, I will hold you two > liable, along with anyone else who may wish to e-mail me. > Have a good one and happy bidding! > . TraderDoug@aol.com: > > Mark - Brock Hattox is a well respected collector who belongs to a group > > of > > well over 100 who collects the same type of cards he does. He has > > shared > > your emails with us. Your attitude is going to cost you a large number > > of > > bidders, including me, on the items you sell. I suggest you > > reconsider. - > > Doug > > ================= Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:48:49 -0700 To: brockhattox@cs.com Subject: Re: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson From: Look like you have no choice Brock. I looked deeper into his feedback, over 75% from buying. The guy is a college student, not very much selling expierence and does not have a clue what you are talking about. How does a card get bent in a screw down holder? I just hope you did not over pay too Big Al in Seattle ================= To: "VCT" , Subject: first set completion.....finally Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 18:42:50 -0400 From: "John Collins" After hunting down 2 cards at the local shop today, I finally put my birthyear set '77 Topps to rest. Though I have been a member of 2 online trading groups for nearly 2 years now, this is my first set completion. The setsI would really like to complete ('55 and '56 Topps) still linger around 40% I must give nearly all of the credit, however, to Mr. Brock Hattox who graciously dumped nearly every common from the set on me when he decided to keep only stars after 1975. This left me with just a few important cards to get. It took awhile, but I can now say I know that feeling that comes with "set completion" the hard way. Definitely a new experience for me. And what a set for '77 -- too many afro's and funky hairdo's and funky uniforms for meto count -- Geez, that is what baseball was like when I came into this world John C. Collins ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 20:11:04 EDT Subject: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Traderdoug@aol.com Here's his response. A great businessman, I'd say. - Doug ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 21:54:26 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson To: TraderDoug@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Sweendoger@aol.com Okay, now I'm pissed. Isn't there something creative that we can do as a group to this guy. What is this guy talking about in the way of harassment with e-mails... I'm harassed by 100 junkmailers a day. In a message dated 7/9/2002 5:12:06 PM Pacific Standard Time, Traderdoug@aol.com writes: > Subj:Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson > Date:7/9/2002 5:12:06 PM Pacific Standard Time > From:Traderdoug@aol.com > To: > Here's his response. A great businessman, I'd say. - Doug > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > OBC-Ramblings-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > Return-Path: > Received: from rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (rly-zd02.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.226]) > by air-zd05.mail.aol.com (v86_r1.15) with ESMTP id MAILINZD52-0709183420; > Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:34:20 -0400 > Received: from panthermail.uwm.edu (www.panthermail.uwm.edu > [129.89.24.20]) by rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (v86_r1.15) with ESMTP id > MAILRELAYINZD29-0709183403; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:34:03 2000 > Received: (from wwwrun@localhost) > by panthermail.uwm.edu (8.11.2/8.11.2/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) id > g69MY3O16929; > Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:34:03 -0500 > To: TraderDoug@aol.com > Subject: Re: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson > Message-ID: <1026254042.3d2b64dae874b@www.panthermail.uwm.edu> > Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 17:34:02 -0500 (CDT) > From: tysn2391@uwm.edu > Cc: Brockhattox@cs.com > References: <19e.4f49e06.2a5cb8aa@aol.com> > In-Reply-To: <19e.4f49e06.2a5cb8aa@aol.com> > MIME-Version: 1.0 > User-Agent: IMP/PHP IMAP webmail program 2.2.4 > X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) > Excuse me?? My attitude is just fine, I wasn't the one who tossed > accusations > around from the get go. I frankly don't care how "respected" anyone is from > others. I base things off personal experience. > Furthermore, I didn't give you permission to e-mail me, consider this a > warning. Per e-commerce laws in WI, further e-mails will constitute > harassment. Check user "speedymccr" on Ebay if you think I'm joking, and > look > up his record under in Milwaukee County Circuit Court. > As far as posting messages in some newsgroup, go for it!! The card was > listed > with a brief description along with a picture of the front and back of the > card. If there were further questions, I could have been e-mailed prior to > bidding. > Anyoine with sense will see who the crybaby is here. > No refunds!! Got it??? > Again, any further e-mails regarding this situation, I will hold you two > liable, along with anyone else who may wish to e-mail me. > Have a good one and happy bidding! > . TraderDoug@aol.com: > > Mark - Brock Hattox is a well respected collector who belongs to a group > > of > > well over 100 who collects the same type of cards he does. He has > > shared > > your emails with us. Your attitude is going to cost you a large number > > of > > bidders, including me, on the items you sell. I suggest you > > reconsider. - > > Doug > > ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:11:55 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: More from Mark Nelson From: "rayluurs" I know this probably wont happen but since he is up on his Wisconsin penal codes for harrasment think he can getting code for fraud after all wouldnt want it thrown out on a technicality --- In OBC-Ramblings@y..., Sweendoger@a... wrote: > Okay, now I'm pissed. > Isn't there something creative that we can do as a group to this guy. What > is this guy talking about in the way of harassment with e-mails... > harassed by 100 junkmailers a day. > Pat > In a message dated 7/9/2002 5:12:06 PM Pacific Standard Time, > Traderdoug@a... writes: > > Subj:Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson > > Date:7/9/2002 5:12:06 PM Pacific Standard Time > > From:Traderdoug@a... > > To: > > > > > > > > Here's his response. A great businessman, I'd say. - Doug > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > OBC-Ramblings-unsubscribe@y... > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > Return-Path: > > Received: from rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (rly-zd02.mail.aol.com > > by air-zd05.mail.aol.com (v86_r1.15) with ESMTP id MAILINZD52- > > Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:34:20 -0400 > > Received: from panthermail.uwm.edu (www.panthermail.uwm.edu > > [129.89.24.20]) by rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (v86_r1.15) with ESMTP id > > MAILRELAYINZD29-0709183403; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:34:03 2000 > > Received: (from wwwrun@localhost) > > by panthermail.uwm.edu (8.11.2/8.11.2/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) > > g69MY3O16929; > > Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:34:03 -0500 > > To: TraderDoug@a... > > Subject: Re: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson > > Message-ID: <1026254042.3d2b64dae874b@w...> > > Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 17:34:02 -0500 (CDT) > > From: tysn2391@u... > > Cc: Brockhattox@c... > > References: <19e.4f49e06.2a5cb8aa@a...> > > In-Reply-To: <19e.4f49e06.2a5cb8aa@a...> > > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > User-Agent: IMP/PHP IMAP webmail program 2.2.4 > > X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) > > > > > > > > Excuse me?? My attitude is just fine, I wasn't the one who tossed > > accusations > > around from the get go. I frankly don't care how "respected" anyone is from > > > > others. I base things off personal experience. > > Furthermore, I didn't give you permission to e-mail me, consider this a > > warning. Per e-commerce laws in WI, further e-mails will > > harassment. Check user "speedymccr" on Ebay if you think I'm joking, and > > look > > up his record under in Milwaukee County Circuit Court. > > > > As far as posting messages in some newsgroup, go for it!! The card was > > listed > > with a brief description along with a picture of the front and back of the > > card. If there were further questions, I could have been e-mailed prior to > > bidding. > > > > Anyoine with sense will see who the crybaby is here. > > > > No refunds!! Got it??? > > > > Again, any further e-mails regarding this situation, I will hold you two > > liable, along with anyone else who may wish to e-mail me. > > > > Have a good one and happy bidding! > > > > > > > > > > . TraderDoug@a...: > > > > > Mark - Brock Hattox is a well respected collector who belongs to a group > > > of > > > well over 100 who collects the same type of cards he does. He > > > shared > > > your emails with us. Your attitude is going to cost you a large number > > > of > > > bidders, including me, on the items you sell. I suggest you > > > reconsider. - > > > Doug > > > > > ================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 22:14:03 -0400 Subject: ebay trouble From: richard a kimball john/group : take this for what its worth,as i was a ebay seller at one time before meeting MAC WUBBEN,my saviour-we did in fact meet through a sale of t206 card and trade of 11 more i think and now im reformed and havent sold since then.bla,bla,bla. i have had problems like this one with ebay and yahoo.the only thing you can do to retaliate per say is to put his name and problem with email address(or item number for safty reasons) on the ebay chat board as topic of conversation,you used to be able to put his name on the ebay wanted board(but that went away).any person who reads the ebay chat board can infact make comments to him and what can he do,hes a dishonest seller and its the right of the ebay community to know that.lets face it most of the buyers on ebay DONT even look at a sellers feedback.i do have 1 negative and 3 neutrals )(out of about 500 total sales/buys)all from the same person who thought that an avg t206 should be perfect in conditon even though i listed the damage,it was his first ebay t206 buy and he only had about 6 feedback then.his ebay name was (TEXRAM) if you run into him and the yahooo seller i bought from who charges shipping on every item,no combinations is (IGUESSED). this is a no win situation with this seller,think of all the good sellers you have dealt with and hope you dont have the same experience again.we should have some place to list all the dead beat sellers/buyers we all dealt with so as not to do it again sorry this was so long and wordy,but it does piss me off too. "THE FUGITIVE" ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 22:33:48 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smart1853@aol.com What you could do to really stick it to this guy ,since it looks like no progress will be made, is wait a while before you leave a neg. Ebay allows you 90 days to post feedback. If you wait and wait until the 90th day and post a negative feedback shortly before the time period expires, he will have no time to retalliate. You'll have left your neg and spared yourself one (most likely he will not have enough time to respond and he did say he would wait for you to post feedback). Just a thought. Brian Dwyer ================= Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 19:34:33 -0700 To: Sweendoger@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson From: I don't see any harm in asking a ebay seller questions. I think he had 5 or 6 items up, times 150 members .... On Tue, 9 Jul 2002 21:54:26 EDT Sweendoger@aol.com wrote: Okay, now I'm pissed. Isn't there something creative that we can do as a group to this guy.  What is this guy talking about in the way of harassment with e-mails... I'm harassed by 100 junkmailers a day. In a message dated 7/9/2002 5:12:06 PM Pacific Standard Time, Traderdoug@aol.com writes: Subj:Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson Date:7/9/2002 5:12:06 PM Pacific Standard Time From:Traderdoug@aol.com Here's his response.  A great businessman, I'd say. - Doug To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. Return-Path: Received: from  rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (rly-zd02.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.226]) by air-zd05.mail.aol.com (v86_r1.15) with ESMTP id MAILINZD52-0709183420; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:34:20 -0400 Received: from  panthermail.uwm.edu (www.panthermail.uwm.edu [129.89.24.20]) by rly-zd02.mx.aol.com (v86_r1.15) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINZD29-0709183403; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 18:34:03 2000 Received: (from wwwrun@localhost)     by panthermail.uwm.edu (8.11.2/8.11.2/SuSE Linux 8.11.1-0.5) id     Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:34:03 -0500 To: TraderDoug@aol.com Subject: Re: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson Message-ID: <1026254042.3d2b64dae874b@www.panthermail.uwm.edu> Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 17:34:02 -0500 (CDT) From: tysn2391@uwm.edu Cc: Brockhattox@cs.com References: <19e.4f49e06.2a5cb8aa@aol.com> In-Reply-To: <19e.4f49e06.2a5cb8aa@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: IMP/PHP IMAP webmail program 2.2.4 X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) Excuse me?? My attitude is just fine, I wasn't the one who tossed accusations around from the get go. I frankly don't care how "respected" anyone is from others. I base things off personal experience.   Furthermore, I didn't give you permission to e-mail me, consider this a warning.  Per e-commerce laws in WI, further e-mails will constitute harassment.  Check user "speedymccr" on Ebay if you think I'm joking, and look up his record under in Milwaukee County Circuit Court. As far as posting messages in some newsgroup, go for it!!  The card was listed with a brief description along with a picture of the front and back of the card. If there were further questions, I could have been e-mailed prior to Anyoine with sense will see who the crybaby is here. No refunds!! Got it??? Again, any further e-mails regarding this situation, I will hold you two liable, along with anyone else who may wish to e-mail me. Have a good one and happy bidding!    .  TraderDoug@aol.com: > Mark - Brock Hattox is a well respected collector who belongs to a group > of > well over 100 who collects the same type of cards he does.  He has > shared > your emails with us.  Your attitude is going to cost you a large number > of > bidders, including me,  on the items you sell.  I suggest you > reconsider. - > Doug To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 23:11:13 -0400 To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson From: Dan Austin An excellent idea! I've thought about this myself in the past. This may be the right time to get such a list started. At 12:11 PM 7/9/02, you wrote: >Brock, He's probably blocked your emails from now on, so I'd say get on with >your life. What's his ebay username again? >This brings up a question I've wondered about from time to time. We're all >telling ourselves now that we won't deal with Brock's guy, but after a few >months it's easy to forget these things. Should there be, somewhere on the >OBC website, a permanent list where members can flag sellers they recommend >staying away from? This would need to be a place accessible only to >members, like the biographies. The list would need to be accompanied by a >member's short narrative of his or her experience with the person, so that >other members could evaluate the problems. There would be cases where some >in the group had had unproblematic or pleasant dealings with the person, and >they could weigh in with their more positive comments, so we'd develop a >balanced group of perspectives on prominent sellers. This wouldn't claim >to be a systematic judgment on dealers, but it would give us a reservoir of >information as we went forward with a transaction. And it would flag total >losers like Mark Nelson-- >What does the OBCAC think about this? ================= Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 23:45:13 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson To: Smart1853@aol.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: ChicoD1@aol.com Date: 7/9/02 10:35:23 PM Eastern Daylight Time To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smart1853@aol.com Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 22:33:48 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] More from Mark Nelson ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 00:41:02 EDT Subject: Selig is an idiot To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Sweendoger@aol.com I just thought I would be the first to voice my opinion on the All Star game... I understand that we shouldn't burn-out a good pitcher, but hey it is only a game. Bring in Sweeney or Shawn Green to pitch a few innings. The game will be over in less than two innings with some exciting hitting and Selig must be stopped, he is ruinning a terrific game! My $0.02, Pat Sweeney (no relation) ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 00:46:58 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot To: Sweendoger@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: mma3026559@aol.com Agree completely. If there was ever a justification to start a 'Fan Strike', tonites game is certainly one.....Since the fan's didn't see a complete game, maybe a 25% (face value) refund is in order..??? ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:07:47 EDT Subject: Fwd: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: topgolf@aol.com Hey, Bud, even world cup soccer has a sudden death shoot out! Giambi vs. Sosa in a sudden death home run derby...send the fans home happy! Rest well, ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:15:49 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Rick's New Updated 1955 list--Down to 6! From: Neal Thomas Hi all- 4 more cards from OBCers in the last 24 hours brings RIcks 1955 list down to 6. I was outbid twice yesterday on a Koufax RC (one of the only 2 big ones left), but will keep looking when I get time. Here is the updated list: 050 (Robinson) 161 (Tanner) 189 (Rizzuto) 190 (Woodling) (6 left) ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 13:00:18 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: How should I handle? From: "obc_ken" Check out http://pages.ebay.com/help/community/insurance.html and file a fraud report on this guy for starters. His description has few words, but most of them misrepresent the item... about the only thing he got right was the year, manufacturer and number on the card. <> The picture looks like it was taken across the room... he might as well have held it out his window and let you look at it from there. Let him delete all the e-mail he wants. Forward a few of the ones he sent you along with a complaint to Safe Harbor. They may do nothing or they might suspend him on eBay and give you $33 back on your card (which is probably about what you overpaid on it anyway). Good luc ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:07:44 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Celenox@aol.com I don't think you can totally jump on Selig......It is an exhibition game and you don't want to see players get hurt....you cant have position players pitch...look what it did to canseco....you just can take the chance....... Im not defending him....i think he was wrong to delay Freddy garcia during the innings......Someone said Possibly a HR hitting contest to decide a winner....thats a cool idea, and no one gets hurt...It would have been cool...... I guess IM being Devils advocate going both ways seeing seligs point and us the fans point. I felt bad for the fans at the game...although as they said on ESPN the fans Handled themselves very well. MAYBEE the true answer was all the ritch OWNERS AND PLAYERS were just tired and wanted to go to sleep.........so they agreed on a bed time.......LOL If anyone agrees or disagrees with my comments let me know ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:21:41 -0700 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Off to China From: john harrell I've been essentially dormant in the group for a while as I've been preparing to lead a group of Huntingdon College students to China in an exchange program. We'll be spending 17 days (14 in Guilin and 3 in Beijing) in China, about half of which will be spent teaching conversational English classes with Chinese high school students. Needless to say, I'm very excited about this opportunity. In any event I'll be out of pocket for about the next month and so will be unsubscribing to the Hope I can find a good card shop in Guilin:-). I will be taking a large box of cards with me as I understand that Chinese youth are very into sports. Maybe there's a Chinese Ruth Goudey somewhere gathering dust I can trade for!! ================= To: Celenox@aol.com obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Selig and problems with the game Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:53:52 -0700 From: "jcollins12" I agree that last night's unfortunate situation was not totally the fault of baseball's esteemed commissioner. The problem with the all star game in itself was years in the making, and it's a wonder something like this didn't happen before now. First, the rosters need to be expanded. They are at 30 men per team now, the same as it was in 1960 when there were only 16 teams, and when it wasn't nearly so big of a deal to "have to play everybody." That worked for 1960, but clearly doesn't today. Also they should consider allowing unlimited substitution just for that game. I doubt the fans would have cared much last night if they had brought, say, Barry Zito back in to pitch, after his strenuous task of facing only one batter previously. I can't say though that I minded seeing Czar Bud get booed in his own backyard. Last night may not have been totally his doing, but some of baseball's other problems are a direct result of his incompetance. I'm sure at least some of you will agree that Bud deserved a 5 minute standing "boo-ation" for all that he has done for the game in the last several years. All in all, I think the end of the game was a fitting commentary on the state of things in baseball right now. >--- Original Message --- >From: Celenox@aol.com >To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com >Date: 7/10/02 4:07:44 AM I don't think you can totally jump on Selig......It is an exhibition game and >you don't want to see players get hurt....you cant have position >pitch...look what it did to canseco....you just can take the chance....... Im >not defending him....i think he was wrong to delay Freddy garcia during the >innings......Someone said Possibly a HR hitting contest to decide >winner....thats a cool idea, and no one gets hurt...It would have been >cool...... I guess IM being Devils advocate going both ways seeing seligs >point and us the fans point. I felt bad for the fans at the >as they said on ESPN the fans Handled themselves very well. >MAYBEE the true answer was all the ritch OWNERS AND PLAYERS were just tired >and wanted to go to sleep.........so they agreed on a bed time.......LOL >If anyone agrees or disagrees with my comments let me know ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:41:57 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: All-Star Game From: "david_skoglund_mn" I dind't manage to see much of the game last night and am just starting to read all the stories on the fiacso at the end. From what I've read so far, both pitchers who were in the game in the 11th had pitched about two innings each. I'm sorry, but since when does pitching more than two innings constitue a hardship? The only thing Selig can do that would be in the best interest of the game is to resign. ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:21:20 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game To: david.skoglund@att.net, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com apparently, one pitcher is scheduled to go tomorrow, and one on sunday. i guess more than 2 innings is more than enough. interesting that they players have almost unanimously approved of calling the game. their 1st job is to help their teams win, and i think selig did the right thing by not penalizing the 2 teams who's pitchers would have had to stay out there. i still think selig must go, but not because of last nite. gm ================= To: , Subject: A cool Grey! Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:13:42 -0700 From: "Geno Wagner" OBCers -- After the All-Star debacle last night, I was pleased to get a Cool Grey high number from Trips today! The Ted Uhlaender reminded me why I like baseball when I flipped it over and read the slew of minor league towns on the back. Thanks, Trips! By the way, here's my solution. All those chukleheads that get All-Start bonuses - make them only payable if they win the game. I want to see a goodgame, not 60 different players. I want Sosa up in the 1st and the 9th if he is the best rightfielder in the league. Reward those moneymongers financially if that's what it takes to give me a good game... Take Care, Geno ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:27:55 -0700 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: sacrifice From: People have been great in giving to the Rick Attack but this has to be the biggest sacrifice I have seen for the cause. Maybe not the money involved but it is almost like ripping out your own heart to give it to a fellow member. In the mail today comes a Johnny Callison 59 rookie card from Rick Svetecz, the biggest Phillie Phan in KC and home of the Callison HOM museum. True, he was a White Sox that year and Rick have the largest collection of Johnny Callison cards in the US but it is like giving a away one of your children. And to you parents I mean one of the good children. Thank you Rick and everyone else for helping with the healing power package. Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:32:29 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Southeast Michigan events of interest to OBC From: "mikesportsfan" This coming weekend there are a few things which might interest OBCers in the Southeast Michigan (Detroit) area. A while back there was some discussion of Vintage (1880s) BB. Some of the folks in the Boston ? area saw a game. This Saturday, the Rochester Grangers are hosting a Vintage BB Tournament with the Woodstock Actives and Kent BB Club from Ohio. The tournament will be held at the Van Hoosen Farm in Rochester Hills, MI on Saturday beginning at noon until 4:00 pm. Many other family activities are planned at the Farm, beginning at 10:00 am. More info call (248) 656-4663 or A couple of card shows coming up this weekend. A show Friday, Saturday and Sunday at Universal Mall in Warren (corner of Dequindre and 12 Mile), which includes Eeks favorite Charlie Paw Paw Maxwell signing autographs ($4 each) Sunday 12:00 - 2:00. Another show, which is relatively new, is also Sunday, July 14 from 9 - 4 at the VFW Hall at Inkster & I-96 in Livonia/Redford area. OBC friendly dealer Mike Sandles will be on hand. Mike makes a show worthwhile on his own. Make sure you let him know you are in OBC with me (1 of the few times, my name is a good reference!)and you should get a better discount. I hope to spend most of the day there Sunday and not at Universal. If anyone plans on attending any of the above please LMK so we can try and hook up. Mike Rich ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:00:18 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Question on how to handle a buyer From: "rayluurs" I have a stupid ebay question but dont know exactly how I should proceed. I recently won (July 2) a 1959 Hank Aaron #380 on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1839551600 Since I knew what shipping and handling cost I checked out tell the seller that I would immediately send out money order upon receiving an address. I subsequently sent another one on Saturday and again on Tuesday(one week past end date) I really didnt get concerned on first two as it was the fourth of July weekend and some people go on vacation, but now it been past a week should I contact ebay about this or let it ride a little longer for said excuse of vacation time. (it doesnt say anything about this in description). I have had other who have been tardy but usually with good excuse and transaction go on with a little delay. He has only one naegative in 40 with a "Mark Nelson" type response and attitude. Am I over reacting and wait or should I contact ebay about not getting a ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:54:31 -0700 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: help needed From: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1841587652 What are these and are they worth $20??? Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:11:19 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot To: Topgolf@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com Mike - What happen? I thought sure you would take control and make sure the game finished! After all, you are the OBC designated Commish! Hell, it was the All Star game and we watched to see the best compete even it meant letting Zitto pitch again after all he only pitched 2/3 (or less) of an inning and several other pitchers could have been thrown out there again! I know it goes against the rules but damn the rules finish the All Star game! Another Baseball Quote: "I want to be remembered as a ballplayer who gave all he had to give." --------Roberto Clemente Tripleplay (Rick) ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:24:14 -0700 To: tply@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot From: I have to add my .015 cents in here. I did not see the game, as I work nights. I think with the current rules it was the best result. I like that every one gets to see all the players. I would hate to see a player ruined for the next start or game because they "had" to play too many extra innings. They could tweak the rules to prevent this from happening in the future and like some have said; a two inning stint would not hurt most pitchers. That would cover a 20 inning game. The position players should go 2-4 innings and get 2 AB if a PH/DH role is filled. More players? Not sure, 30 is a lot most years. As for Selig, he is a lier for the start and a jerk the rest of the time. Mike Hair for Commish of BB! Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:24:34 -0400 (EDT) To: tply@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot From: Originaleek@webtv.net To: Topgolf@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:11:19 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot Mike - What happen? I thought sure you would take control and make sure the game finished! After all, you are the OBC designated Commish! Hell, it was the All Star game and we watched to see the best compete even it meant letting Zitto pitch again after all he only pitched 2/3 (or less) of an inning and several other pitchers could have been thrown out there again! I know it goes against the rules but damn the rules finish the All Star game! Another Baseball Quote: "I want to be remembered as a ballplayer who gave all he had to give." --------Roberto Clemente Tripleplay (Rick) ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:52:39 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: topgolf@aol.com Hey, we all know the old saying... THERE IS NO TYING IN BASEBALL Regardless of what happened last night, it is a shame that the powers that be with baseball didn't think of the possibility of a tie before the game started. Making up rules as you go does not bode well for a game that is suffering image problems as it is. In a related item, the Vegas Sportbooks had to refund all the bets on the Rest well, ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" Subject: Peter Shack Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:58:37 -0400 From: "Bob Donaldson" I received an email from Peter Shack offering to trade. Has anyone traded with him? ================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:07:36 -0400 Subject: ebay From: richard a kimball dont think that if you wait untill the last day of your 90 days to leave feedback that the seller cant give you a negative also.if you have the item number,per ebay rules you can leave a negative or any feedback for the entire time you are a ebay member,it will bite you in the ass in the just let it lay at least untill he leaves you a negative,and as i said nobody looks at your feedback except for the number next to your id ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:25:31 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] ebay To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smart1853@aol.com In a message dated 7/10/02 10:13:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, kimballrw@juno.com writes: > dont think that if you wait untill the last day of your 90 days to leave > feedback that the seller cant give you a negative also.if you have the > item number,per ebay rules you can leave a negative or any feedback for > the entire time you are a ebay member,it will bite you in the ass in the > end. Perhaps this is true but if one looks at the situation, it would appear that this seller is not the type to keep meticulous records. If a seller doesn't do much selling and won't be accountable for his mistakes, the chances that he would bother to save records of the item would appear small. After three months, he will have either forgotten or given up and left a neg first. If the latter happens, then so be it; it was unavoidable. Either way, this seller appears immature and irresponsible. So, that is my view. Somewhat stereotypical maybe, but my feelings nonetheless. Brian Dwyer ================= Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:41:19 EDT Subject: OBC Hat! To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com [Unable to display image] ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:21:39 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-RAMBLINGS@Yahoogroups.com Subject: ebay/ Selig Top 10 list from Letterman/ Leno joke ref TW From: keithsummers@webtv.net I THINK ebay has changed it so you can NOT leave feedback after 90 days. BUT, I am almost positive you used to be able to do it as long as you had the item/ auction #. Or, am I mixing this up with retrieving the "ebay user info" on someone? Seems like Reed, Rittenberg & myself discussed this privately a few months back. At any rate, even if the guy did not keep detailed records, when Brock leaves the negative on the 89th day, the "item #" will then be right there for the guy to see :-( But, can he reply quick enough IF the deadline is 90 days? He can at least RESPOND TO FEEDBACK & claim he sent a clear photo...even though it was in bullet proof plastic, with a .5 megapixel camera from 7 feet away :-) To protest we could all make a bid on one of his items, then retract it. There's no penalty to retract a bid. It shows as one retraction in your feedback but you can do it at least 3 times in a 6 month span . That way he'd see what an impact his one decision had. Can you imagine even 40 retractions in one auction! In ref to the July 2nd purchase, I suggest retrieving his ebay user info. They email both parties (buyer & seller) with the info which has registeration date, name, address, phone # & item # it is in ref to. This should get his attention & see you are serious about getting the card. If not after 2 more days, give him a call. If the phone # does not reach him, contact ebay as I think the # has to be kept up to date. Good luck :-) ============================== Top 10 Little known Facts about Selig ============================== Throws like a girl. Wife complains about contraction too (if you know what I mean). Refuses to admit that Ted Williams is the best cryogenically (sp?) frozen player of all time. And the best one that I remember was: Recently bet $10K in Vegas on the All Star game ending in a tie :-) I may have them slightly worded wrong & it may be on the net somewhere by the time you read this ( www.CBS.com ? or maybe www.LateNight.com ?). Some newspapers reprint the Top 10 list the next day so check your Thursday & Friday papers if you care. I heard another one, I think on Leno or Greg Kilborn a couple nights ago that goes like this: "It was so hot today that people were claiming to be related to Ted Williams just to get their head frozen!" Don't send me your letters I didn't write it :-) ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:02:37 EDT Subject: This Week in Baseball Cards To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: JEdward@aol.com In a never ending effort to clean up some of the clutter that's been laying around on my desk, I thought this week I'd just offer up a few cards to the waiver wire: 1962 Post #25 Charley Maxwell, Detroit Tigers. This card was diverted from it's proper place at the 'House of Maxwell' and I ended up with two. Eek suggested I try to find a worthy and caring Tiger fan who will give Charley a good home. 1960 Leaf #60 Clem Labine, Dodgers 1963 Topps #552 Tigers Team 1965 Topps Embossed # 15 Don Drysdale, 38 Bob Allison, 43 Bill White, 66 Dean Chance, 67 Dick Ellsworth. 1967 Topps #234 ERA Leaders, Koufax/Cuellar/Marichal 1973 Topps # 191 Tigers Team These cards are typical OBC condition cards and available to anyone OBC, it's an attitude John's Old Baseball Card Site ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:10:47 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-RAMBLINGS@Yahoogroups.com Subject: 61 Top 10s with From: keithsummers@webtv.net ================= To: , , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:47:52 -0700 From: "yaz" V. Padilla and F. Garcia both last pitched on July 4th. Padilla went 7.3 innings and Garcia went 7. Both had 4 days rest. Padilla had 4 days between his last starts Garcia, 5. Brenly was not giving straight facts when he saidafter the game that Padilla had pitched just two days before. 30 Players played in the All Star game. 14 runs were scored. There were several outstanding plays on defense. None of the players were deemed "Valuable" enough to receive the Ted Williams Award. Selig, throwing up his hands in dispair is why he needs to step down as commisioner. He can't handle the job at all. He never expected an extra inninggame to happen? One out every 7 All-star games have been extra innings. The last one 8 years ago. What's not to expect?? Torre and Brenly mismanaged.Brenly mispicked his pitching staff. Selig peed all over himself when theycame to him to bail them out. The All-star game is a part of the Major League baseball season even thoughthe game doesn't count in the standings. Teams, managers, and players should adjust themselves to the fact and play ball. If I remember correctly, Ted Williams broke an elbow in an all star game and Pete Rose broke a Fosse. Stuff like that happens. But Barry Bonds on Jay Leno's show tonight summed it up from the MLB point of view pretty well tonight. "Players make too much money nowadays to risk having someone get hurt" Uhhhh, OK Barry. Greg (yaz) ----- Original Message ----- From: smartalecx@aol.com To: david.skoglund@att.net ; OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2002 11:21 AM Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game apparently, one pitcher is scheduled to go tomorrow, and one on sunday. iguess more than 2 innings is more than enough. interesting that they players have almost unanimously approved of calling the game. their 1st job is to help their teams win, and i think selig did the right thing by not penalizing the 2 teams who's pitchers would have had to stay out there. i still think selig must go, but not because of last nite. gm To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:43:01 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-RAMBLINGS@Yahoogroups.com Subject: EBay to Buy PayPal in $1.5 Billion Deal/ BillPoint closing down From: keithsummers@webtv.net ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:58:39 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Traderdoug@aol.com Seems to me we're making a big deal out of nothing. We got to see 11 innings of baseball with most of the greatest players currently playing the game. Who cares if there was a winner ... it's not like the winner is going to play in the world series. This is an exibition game. Get real. - Doug ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:15:39 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game To: TraderDoug@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com very well said doug! ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:55:49 -0400 Subject: FW: Fan Strike Tomorrow/CNN Covers Us! To: OBC Ramblings From: Jimmy Parker Hey guys and gals, Just a quick forwarded message to remind you of today's "Fan Strike" As hard as it may be to forego baseball for the day, perhaps if enough fans do it, the owners and players will realize that without us all of their bickering becomes moot. Save the gum for me... From: manager@takebackbaseball.com Reply-To: manager@takebackbaseball.com Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:45:59 -0700 To: "Take Back Baseball!" Subject: Fan Strike Tomorrow/CNN Covers Us! TAKE BACK BASEBALL: http://www.takebackbaseball.com July 11th Fan Strike: Final Day =96 Spread the Word! Just one more day until we the fans throw the first strike. We've got momentum. And we're getting attention =96 including a live interview last night on CNN=92s =93Headline News.=94 If we can keep this up, we really might just shame, embarrass, and scare these guys into finally settling their differences =96 and keep them from trashing another baseball season. So here's our pitch =96 take a few seconds right now, forward this to as many baseball fans as you can, and tell them to sign our Fan Strike petition at http://www.TakeBackBaseball.com. July 11th Fan Strike: CNN Coverage! And Much More... They said fans couldn=92t make an impact. =93They=94 were wrong. The media has picked up on this story in a major way, with coverage of TakeBackBaseball and our coalition partners by radio stations, newspapers, and online media. And last night, TakeBackBaseball.com Team =93Captain=94 Heather Holdridge was even interviewed on CNN=92s Headline News. Why is this important? Because coverage like this makes the players, the owners, and the Commissioner look really, really bad. They are businesspeople. They worry about losing =93customers=94 and they worry about tarnishing the baseball brand. (Of course, that didn=92t bother Bud Selig when he called last night=92s All-Star Game tied at 7-7.) The more impact we make, the more they worry. The more they worry, the greater the likelihood they will pay attention and give the fans the seat at the table we deserve. So... If You Want To Save The Season, SPREAD THE WORD! It=92s the bottom of the ninth, and here=92s our last pitch, comin=92 down Broadway. The Fan Strike is tomorrow. The more supporters we get, the more coverage we get, the greater our chance of making an impact =96 and saving this season. So, do whatever you can to spread the word: * Forward this email to your friends, family, and anyone else you know who cares about our game, and tell them to go to http://www.TakeBackBaseball.com and sign up for the strike. Even if your team is not home, or not playing tomorrow, our numbers are strength. * Add this to your email signature: July 11th: Baseball Fan Walkout Day! http://www.TakeBackBaseball.com. * Know any reporters? Tell them about http://www.TakeBackBaseball.com. If you=92re in these cities, or a fan of these teams, your support is especially crucial. These are the home teams for tomorrow=92s games. Toronto Blue Jays Houston Astros Tampa Bay Devil Rays NY Mets Baltimore Orioles Kansas City Royals Minnesota Twins Detroit Tigers Cleveland Indians LA Dodgers Milwaukee Brewers Montreal Expos San Francisco Giants Thanks again for supporting www.TakeBackBaseball.com! The momentum is building, we're getting attention, and if we can keep it up, we might just save this season from being "going, going, gone." The TakeBackBaseball.com Coalition July 11th: Baseball Fan Walkout Day! Spread the Word! http://www.TakeBackBaseball.com. You are currently subscribed to strike as: catfishparkerad@earthlink.net To unsubscribe send a blank email to ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Selig is an idiot Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:28:12 -0400 From: "Robert Reed" My thoughts on the All Star game. I don't think more players is the answer. I've always felt bad for the guys that went there and never got in the game. Adding more players would make it even more difficult to get everybody in the game. Here are some of my suggestions to break ties for the future some of which have already been mentioned.... 1) Allow re-entry for extra innings. Guys who pinch hit or pitched to one batter will be able to go back in the game. 2) Start each extra inning with a man on second (the last out from the previous inning). We did this in my fast pitch softball days and it allows for a variety of strategies. You basically start each inning with a leadoff 3) Bring emergency players to put in if the game last too long. Veterens who have been there before probably won't want to do this but I'm sure they'll have no problem finding some young players who would just love to sit the bench the whole game with just a slight chance of seeing any action. 4) Home run hitting contest between the Home Run leaders from each league. Oops, that won't work because Torre took Robin Ventura and 5 Shortstops instead of Jim Thome. 5) Pick a ticket at random and let a lucky fan come in to pitch. Should make things interesting. 6) Let the All Star captains go into pitch. Ozzie would be able to field his position and with Yount they wouldn't have to pinch hit when the pitcher's spot comes up. 7) Let Willie Randolph come into pitch. The way he was serving them up in the HR Contest that game wouldn't go past the 10th inning. The other problem I had with the game was Why no MVP? Just because the game was a tie shouldn't mean they can't pick an MVP. They just renamed the award in honor of Ted Williams so they should pick somebody. Co-MVP's would have been better than nothing and I think Konerko and Damien Miller would have made good choices. Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:15:40 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game From: Originaleek@webtv.net From: OriginalEEK@webtv.net (Earl Kilbourn) Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 17:13:21 -0400 (EDT) To: Traderdoug@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:06:28 EDT Subject: Some guys have all the luck... To: OBC-Ramblings@Yahoogroups.com From: malsman250@cs.com So, anyway, I'm at my neighbor's house, he is a casual card collector and has some near sets from the late 60s - I told him that I would try to help him finish them (more about that in a future e-mail...) So he tells me that he bought a few cards at a garage sale a few years back, said he paid about $15 for them. I took a look - just a 54 Topps Ted Williams, a 54 Bowman Mays, a Duke Snider, an Ashburn, about 30 52s. Gee, not too bad, I think he got his money's worth.... ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 20:05:36 EDT Subject: This week in Everett To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com, jgreco@us.imshealth.com, From: cardclctor@aol.com Hi gang, Been a while since I've sent out a good ramble just for the purpose of having something to type. Things haven't been too exciting around here recently... at least up until the 4th of July holiday anyway. The day before however, I got a phone call when I got home from work. It was my store manager informing me that I was selected to be transferred to another store starting next (this) week. Apparently someone at the other Revere store was having 'personality conflicts' with the crew chief there and needed to be moved out ASAP. Having the most seniority on the night crew only means I make the most money. So the manager, looking at his bottom line, decided I was the one to go. Well, he gets what he pays for I guess. From what I gathered from my new co-workers, this could be likened to trading Hank Aaron for Tommie Aaron. My commute time has increased by about five minutes and the pet food aisle is a complete disaster area, but I should be adjusted to my new surroundings in a week or two. Meanwhile, the guy I was traded for has already been shipped out of my old store after a week... I guess he didn't impress anyone in his short stint over there either. On a related note, some of my softball teammates were wondering just yesterday if the dented cans were half price like in the movie "Big Daddy". Well, I happened to be walking by the damaged rack (which they keep at the end of the pet food aisle) and noticed some dog food cans marked down to 49 cents... The regular retail on them was 2/.89, so the dented ones were about a nickel more. I noticed another can that was 'marked down' to 59=A2 that you could purchase without a dent at 2/$1. It's a good thing we don't sell old baseball cards I guess. I wonder if Brock's eBay nemesis might be doing markdowns at my new store? On Tuesday, I took my cousin to Six Flags New England with some free passes I got for being an AOL member. (I wish I still had the link I was forwarded, so everyone on AOL could get some free passes.) The first ride we decided to try was called 'Scream'. It's basically one of those machines that takes you from the ground to a position 205 feet above the Earth in about two seconds and then immediately back down as if you were free falling... I never understood why this sort of ride interested people until I sat in the chair. At the peak of the initial ascent, when you leave the seat and are only being held in by the shoulder harness, you get a weightless feeling and realize you're very high above the ground. However, I think my jaw almost hit that ground some 200+ feet below. I know they have a similar ride at the top of the Stratosphere in Vegas. I can't imagine adding a few hundred more feet to that without soiling my underwear. Next ride we went on was called Superman: The Ride of Steel. It was hyped as the tallest and fastest (77mph) roller coaster in the world. My cousin and I decided to wait an hour in line... and then another 1/2 hour more to get the front seat. Then we had to wait a little longer as they decided to put the second train into operation just as we reached the head of the line. The first drop came up on us and I noticed that the tracks didn't just drop straight down... they seemed to drop completely out of sight. It was a wild ride that sent us underground twice, but I was feeling slightly queasy Therefore, the next ride we opted for was called "Route 66". It was a relaxing ride through the country on a track in an old style car. I let my cousin do the 'driving', since I had driven the two hours to the park. I also sat in the back seat, since the passenger door of my car doesn't open (Steve R. can attest to this) and he normally rides in the back seat (although for the long trip, he climbed over my seat to sit in the front). At the end of the ride, I handed him the $5 bill I owed him from the parking lot fee. Now feeling my legs, I headed over to an inverted floorless roller coaster called "The Mind Eraser". This almost became the 'lunch eraser', as it twisted you in various directions, most of which you had no idea you were going to be headed in... then you're suddenly stopped on a dime. My cousin wanted to go back on right away on the front seat this time, since there was no line. (Everyone was still waiting in line for the Superman coaster I guess). I declined and waited in the shade looking at the park map for a place to eat instead. It was getting really hot, so to cool off a little we tried out the log ride before eating. I didn't get wet - I was completely soaked, but it was worth the wait for that ride. We then walked over to a pizza place that boasted air conditioning (that was the big selling point) and got a pizza for just under $20 - this place is really just like Disney, only closer to home. After lunch, we walked by the Superman ride again and noticed THERE WAS NO LINE! Thinking this was some kind of joke, we headed right up to the gate in three minutes (since we decided not to wait for the front seat this time.) We ended up waiting a while anyway, since the ride experienced technical difficulties just as we were about to get on the next train. We eventually rode around twice more and figured out where they took the photo of you which they'll sell you for an exhorbitant amount of money after your ride... we got one and headed to the other major coaster in the park: "Batman - The Dark Knight". The two trips through Superman left me sorta dizzy, so I decided I wanted to keep my $15 lunch inside me and sit the next one out. My cousin's luck continued to get worse though, as they shut down the Batman ride for maintenece as he reached the head of the line. We then headed to the north end of the park. My cousin left me to ride a looping, twisting coaster called 'Flashback', which sent you through a series of spins and twists and up a hill... and then sent you through the whole thing again, only backwards so you have no idea where you're going. Still feeling slightly out of it after five slices of pizza and the two additional runs through 'Superman', I waited at a table sipping my frozen lemonade and deciding which coaster I wanted to try next.I looked at the old wooden coaster named 'The Cyclone' and figured it wouldn't be so bad... I was wrong, very wrong. This ride is actually painful. Instead of a smooth turn at five G's like Superman, this slams you into right angle turn, then snaps your neck and back the other way while launching you up and down at the same time. Any chiropractor could set up shop at the end of the ride and make a fortune. I didn't know if I wanted to throw up or cry as we hobbled back to the Batman ride, which was now fixed. I watched this one from a park bench that still felt like it was moving a little - maybe the next time I visit, I'll feel a little better. On the way out, I hit a free throw and won a basketball for two bucks and my cousin splurged for a Batman T-shirt. The ride home was very smooth compared to what I had become used to bearing. We arrived back home just in time for it to start pouring and cancel the softball game I was going to play (and the reason we didn't stay until the park closed). Had a great time overall, but now I'm going to rest up for my next trip - that's Chicago in one month. TAYL, Ken M ================= To: "ramblings" Subject: ebay id ??? Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:23:56 -0400 From: "Sean McGowan" is bre_mac one of us? ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 23:12:49 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game To: TraderDoug@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com Doug - To "Get Real" they would have to finish the game! In real baseball there is no ties! These overpaid brats could have given the fans that shelled out $175.00+ each for seats and millions that watched on TV a complete game. ================= Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 23:17:34 EDT Subject: the EXPOS To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Celenox@aol.com HERE is a crazy idea.......Lets get OBCers all togethr and chip in some money, and Purchase the EXPOS and relocate them to either Va.....or Brooklyn NY ...why not im sure the price is cheap enough.....and if we could convince mets owner Wilpon to buy part he would let us move into NY....the Cyclones Mets minor league team has a better attendance then the Expos....so lets do ================= To: , , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 23:57:53 -0700 From: "yaz" "shelled out $175.00+ each for seats" Not to mention, a week's pay for brats, beer and parking. Greg (yaz) ----- Original Message ----- From: tply@aol.com To: TraderDoug@aol.com ; OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2002 8:12 PM Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] All-Star Game Doug - To "Get Real" they would have to finish the game! In real baseballthere is no ties! These overpaid brats could have given the fans that shelled out $175.00+ each for seats and millions that watched on TV a complete game. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 02:48:18 EDT Subject: PNC PARK To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Celenox@aol.com Hello All Rob Gioia here. Well, I was told to get this story out....Last weekend I took my son on alittle road trip to Pittsburgh. We obviously went to see the New PNC park, and man did it exceed my expectations. First before the game at noon my son and I went on a tour of the park, and talk about reasonable...the tour was a 2 hour tour and cost $6.00 for adults and $3.00 for kids. The tour was great...They Took us all over the park. We went on the field, we took a glimpse into the Pirates clubhouse, we went into the batting cages we visited a luxury suite, and the Press box...wow what a fun experience.....Also they asked questions about the park at the end and I won a Bandana with PNC park on it...it was very nice. As we went to the stadium for the game Pittsburgh had closed the street outside the stadium for a small Kids Fair.....they had Jumping balloons for the kids a wall/obstacle course for the kids/face painting, kids batting cages, kids pitching cages and a few other games...all for free.... Now finally my son and I decided to walk around the park outside for a minute there were beautiful Statues of Roberto Clemente, Willie Stargell, and Honus Wagner...my son and I took Pictures of the 2 of us with the statues....Very Beautiful. Finally we made it into the park. The Park was beautiful......the most beautiful ive seen so far and ive been to 10 parks. This park is very Family Oriented. There is a kids corner in the park where the kids could play in a supervised playground...there are 700 TV's in the park so you don't miss a thing. Lets talk about the game for a minute....Well it was the Astros vs the Pirates....I don't particularly care for either team but had to see the stadium....my son and i watched 5 innings from our seats on the first base side(very Good seats). then he got alittle antsy...so we went to the playground. after an inning in the playground we went to get him a temp tattoo and he loved it.....then we watched a few innings in the right field wall. Not a bad seat in the place. Now comes the fun stuff....I couldn't day no to my son....so i wound up buying him a Pirates Bobble head doll, Mike Piazza bobble head doll (his fav player)a Jason Kendall jersey, a pirates helmet, a pirates banner...and food he ate 2 dogs, pop corn and a pizza...God bless that young The final score was 10-1 astros......and we got to see some history....Darryl Ward hit the first Homer into the Allegheny River. All for all it was the Best Baseball park Experience.....after it was over my son said to me "Daddy I wish this day would never end because i had such a great time with you" it almost brought a tear to my eye.....the fact that my son had a better time then me at a ball game mad it the BEST here are some pics if interested copy and paste http://members.aol.com/celenox/pnctrip.html 5star rating Thanx for listening to my story and a very special thanx to JIM WIEHE (xtrjmx@aol.com) for helping me with the web page ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 16:11:06 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Back from Vacation From: "kevin71058" Hi all, I am back Lost Wages (Las Vegas)..and I am glad to say I lost a little weight there , as my wallet is just a bit lighter. Hope everyone has been well. There are a few cards I owe a few people and once I get organized I promise to send those out. By the way it was 110 or better degrees in Las Vegas and I do not care that it is a "DRY HEAT" it was freaking HOT!!!. I came home to Long Island and it was 63 degrees so my wife is looking for her winter coat..lol Take care, ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 20:38:28 EDT Subject: Fantasy FB help needed To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Jrhatchjr@aol.com And now for something completely different... If anyone out there plays fantasy football, I'd appreciate any feedback on some of the stat services out there. My league has been using CBS Sportsline for a few years, but they're going to charge us $120 for the season. Of course I, being the tightwad I am, don't want to pay this for a short money league. Any suggestions on less expensive (or even free) services I can look into to offer as alternatives for our league? ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 09:23:43 +0800 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: WL Project From: Lynn Miller Hi Gang, Thanks for all the inputs I've gotten. That list has been compiled and hopefully we will be able to start something in the near future. I didn't receive inputs from the following. If I missed it I apologize, just let me know and I'll look for it again or do it myself. But in case some of you may not have received it the first time. I'm looking for all the sets (pre-1980) that you collect. We will include everyone. But it would make it easier if you send me individually your lists instead of me having to go to the webpage and hand-typing each list separately. This is an example: 1952 Topps 1952 Topps Wings NS 1963 Fleer 1965 Topps Embossed 1968 Topps Game 1970-71 Topps BK 1971-72 Topps HK 1976 Topps FB if you collect sports or cards other than baseball, use BK for Hockey, BB for Basketball, FB for Football and NS for non-sports Thanks for your help, Lynn John Ball Andy Baran Jim Beauchemin Yuk Chow Jerry Coker Greg Conway James Cooper Al Cummings Dick Cummings Doug DeJong Wayne Delia Jeff Delott Mike Diamanti Terry Dietrick Sal Domino Brett Domue Joe Duffy Rick Ellison Bob Farrell Rob Fitts Brad Fox Rob Gioia Joel Glickman Ignacio Gonzales Richard Hankins John Hathcock George Hay Steve Hitzeman Dave Hornish Doug Julien Jim Kalina Rick Keating Mike Kinney David Kolenda Greg Kuhn Josh Levine Dennis Linden Mark Macrae Kevin Martens John McLaughlin Greg Miller George Moore Robert Moore Carl Mura David Nathan Chuck Paris Ron Perry Robert Pigeon Ed Pike Dave Purdham Roger Raum Rick Redpath (I'll take care of this one) Rob Reed Steve Rittenberg Jeff Sackmann Sam Saletta Bob Schaub Sassy Schoenrock Ed Schott Jim Silva John Storman Keith Summers Rick Svetecz Mark Talbot Frank Thomas (Dave can you help me?) Larry Tipton (no WL posted) George Vrechek Art Wainwright Bob Wells Mike Wierzbicki Tom Williams Kevin Wolf Terry Woods Mark Zentkovich Larry Zurawski ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 21:36:48 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Gardening question (sort of) From: Neal Thomas Hey all- I am sitting here with my folks watching the Red Sox lose and the Y_____S win, and my mom came up with a question--how do they get those designs in the field? DIfferent lengths, different mowing techniques?? Any one know? ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 21:39:45 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Gardening question (sort of) To: nthomas@pol.net From: smart1853@aol.com I would imagine that they mow in a similar fashion to tending putting greens. Putting green mowers cut closer and the designs in the outfield often resemble a close cut green. Not totally sure, but my best guess. ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 21:45:31 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Rick's New Updated 1955 list--Down to 5! From: Neal Thomas Hi all- Found a RObinson card on ebay pretty cheap, so Rick's list is now down to 5 cards--any help in knocking these off? Here is the updated list: 161 (Tanner) 189 (Rizzuto) 190 (Woodling) (5 left) ================= Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 22:12:59 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Gardening question (sort of) To: nthomas@pol.net, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: topgolf@aol.com The mowing patterns are the brain child of David Mellor, the head groundskeeper for the Red Sox. The stripping and logos are done with a reel type mower with a heavy roller and devices known as Wiehle rollers (developed by Ted Wiehle, a former golf course Superintendent from Michigan). In order to "burn in" stripes and patterns they use metal drag mats behind the mowers. David has written a book "Picture Perfect" in which he explains many of the Rest well, ================= To: nthomas@pol.net Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 22:06:45 -0500 Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Gardening question (sort of) From: Rick Keating My nephew is a grounds keeper (intern) for the River City Rascals, independent league team near St. Louis. I think he said they have rollers on the mowers that bend or flatten the grass. Different directions, or maybe different weights(?) form the designs. I can ask him to post a more detailed explanation, if you're interested. - Rick On Fri, 12 Jul 2002 21:36:48 -0400 (EDT) Neal Thomas > Hey all- > I am sitting here with my folks watching the Red Sox lose and the > Y_____S win, and my mom came up with a question--how do they get > those designs in the field? DIfferent lengths, different mowing > techniques?? Any one know? > Neal > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > OBC-Ramblings-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 00:07:49 EDT Subject: Staten Island Yankees squeak by Renegades To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: WMDpks@aol.com My family and I just got back from Dutchess Stadium after a fireworks display following a Class A NY-Penn league game which the Hudson Valley Renegades lost in the ninth inning. Tied 3-3 going into the ninth, the Yankees managed to squeak by the 'Gades by a final score of 16 to 4. They batted around TWICE in the inning, and the first twelve hitters reached base. Yipe. Wayne Delia, WMDpks@aol.com Delta Iota Chapter Advisor, Phi Kappa Sigma at Marist College "There goes the greatest hitter who ever lived." (Ted Williams, 1918-2002) ================= To: Subject: 1953 Topps question Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 22:08:07 -0700 From: "Geno Wagner" OBCers -- I noticed in my big SCD Price Guide that some of the high number cards are priced about half of the rest. It's only a few, and no where does it mention double prints. Is this a misprint on those cards or is there actually double-printed '53 high numbers that are supposedly worth half the price??? Thanks, Geno ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 01:54:15 -0400 Subject: See ya Down in FLA!!!! To: OBC Ramblings From: Mark S Talbot Hello All, I must also announce that I will be in Orlando FL. for business from Sunday the 14th through Tuesday the 23rd of July. I will be staying at the Wyndham Resort through the 19th (Our conference is being held there) and at the Airport Days Inn the 20th through the 23rd for some R&R time. I'm bringing my wife and daughter (they will be vacationing while I work) and would love to meet up with anyone who wishes to do so. LMK tomorrow if interested as I am not likely to have internet access for about 10 days. BE WELL!!! REGARDS --------------------------------- MARK "Live long and prosper" - Spock * Mark S. Talbot * * 34030 Chatsworth Drive * * Sterling Heights, MI. * * 48312-4604 * * talbot1@comcast.net * ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 14:10:44 EDT Subject: 1953 Mother's Cookies To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com OBC - The following 1953 Mother's Cookies are currently on EBay and I already have them in my collection. I thought some of you might be interested: eBay item 1842642742 (Ends Jul-18-0219:58:03 PDT ) - 1953 MOTHER'S COOKIES ~ # eBay item 1842643384 (Ends Jul-18-0219:59:08 PDT ) - 1953 MOTHER'S COOKIES eBay item 1842644061 (Ends Jul-18-0220:00:07 PDT ) - 1953 MOTHER'S COOKIES ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 14:23:27 EDT Subject: bound for the hall of fame To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: dsh46@aol.com hey gang: well, the family and i are heading upstate for five days of r and r. we'll be hitting cooperstown on this trip. i haven't been in 11 years and am curious to see how the town looks these. when i was dealing cards in the late 80's my partner and i looked into moving up there and opening a shop but it was way too expensive. it's a beautiful little town though, for those of you who haven't been. i'm hoping i can find a few cards from the ol' list up there but experience tells me the prices will be sky high. talk to you all when i get back, ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 14:32:24 EDT Subject: ebay 51 Bowman Mantle rookie To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- there is a 51 Bowman Mantle rookie on ebay right now- # 1843648761 eBay item 1843648761 (Ends Jul-20-0208:... i wonder what this one will end up selling for ??? G- Vg?? Linda ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 14:36:52 EDT Subject: Mays 1951 Bowman To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- Mays 51 Bowman rookie on ebay- # 1843644167- eBay item 1843644167 (Ends Jul-20-0207:... i wonder what this one will go for? Linda ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 18:21:16 EDT Subject: FINALLY returning! To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: t206guy@aol.com Greetings to everyone As a youth minister I find that my summers, while a nice break from school for the teens, are nonstop chaos for myself. Last night at 11:30 I returned from my final major activity of this summer. I have been gone all but 3 days of the last 5 weeks. I have several of you to thank for things including James Moletta, Andy Cook, Mike Weirzbicki, and Geno Wagner. I suppose I should dive into a dissertation on the fact that my conclusions regarding recent activities are as follows. I hate Bud Selig, I hate the players union, I hate small ballparks and if they strike I hope the game dies and must be "rebirthed" in some way. Most of you know my ideas as to HOW to do that but if not I will tell you more in the upcming weeks. In any event, I hope to get right on a few projects including sending reprisals to a whole stack of OBCers, writing another SCD article about some uncataloged cards I have, and sitting back and watching a few games. It's good to be back. Mark T206Guy Atnip ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 16:39:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: TRADE PARTNERS 50B, 57, 66, & 69 TOPPS To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: John Storman I HAVE BEEN VERY BUSY AND KIND OF OUT OF IT AS FAR AS BASEBALL CARDS ARE CONCERNED BUT NOW I HAVE A LITTLE MORE TIME AND AM LOOKING FOR PEOPLE INTERESTED IN TRADING 50 BOWMAN, 57, 66, & 69 TOPPS. I'M GOINHG TO UPDATED MY LIST ON OBC BUT IF YOU ARE INTERESTED, I CAN SEND MY LATEST WANTLIST. THANKS, JOHN Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes http://autos.yahoo.com ================= Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 16:50:23 -0700 To: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] ebay 51 Bowman Mantle rookie From: I see you already got out bid. $188 with 6 days to go. Might get ugly. Big Al in Seattle On Sat, 13 Jul 2002 14:32:24 EDT jazzgirl1920s@aol.com wrote: hi- this is Linda- there is a 51 Bowman Mantle rookie on ebay right now- # 1843648761 eBay item 1843648761 (Ends Jul-20-02 08:... i wonder what this one will end up selling for ??? G- Vg?? Linda ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Save on REALTOR Fees http://us.click.yahoo.com/Xw80LD/h1ZEAA/Ey.GAA/QBiolB/TM To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 03:58:01 EDT Subject: Family and baseball To: nikkimmueller@yahoo.de, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com, ALYnCALI@aol.com From: Wite3@aol.com I just wanted to relay one happened to me today. It was a singular baseball experience but had rather unexpected impact on my life. As most of you already know, I gathered my love of baseball mostly from my grandfathers (mostly my mother's father) and my own father. Growing up, one or the other was always involved in my baseball experiences. Whether it was my first taste of major league experience with my grandfather taking me to a game at Dodger Stadium or my dad throwing the ball with me (still does to this day, and I hate to admit that he still has the better arm) I grew up with baseball around me. There have been times when my dad and my grandfather were there at the same time for one of my baseball memories including little league games, the occasional Dodger or Angel game, and even watching my father resume his baseball career at fifty. I cherished all those memories. In fact, my penultimate baseball moment was seen by both these gentlemen just a scant five years ago when I managed play one game dressed in Dodger home whites on the field at Dodger Stadium. But five years is a long time. Five years ago, I was 25 years old. My father was 54, just entering his third season of baseball, and my grandfather had just turned 80, still able to drive himself to Dodger Stadium to watch his grandson fulfill the dreams of three generations (if you missed that story, ask me, I will relay it in another letter). Five years have passed. Five short and long years. Which brings us to Saturday, July 13th. My season tickets are in the Loge level, which is one level up from the Field level at Dodger Stadium. My grandparents wanted to go to a Dodger game, so my parents decided to take them. Because of their advanced age and limited mobility, they bought Field level seats with handicapped access (just to the 1st base side of homeplate---some truly great house seats). I knew my parents were at the game but was not sure I would be able to get down to meet them, often the security does not let you go down to the field level. Thus, I met my friend and his father at the game, sat with them for the first three innings and then went in search of my parents. After five minutes of talking to a very dim security guard, I finally had to ask to see a senior usher. Showed the usher my season ticket, told him I wanted to visit my parents, flashed my MLBPAA card he escorted me down to where they were sitting. I came up behind my grandparents who were thrilled to see me at the game. I sat with my father on one side of my and my grandfather on the other. It was wonderful and made me feel like I was 10 years old again. It was amazing that the knowledge that my family has of the game has not diminished one bit. I watched amazed as Brian Anderson balked and my grandfather called it before the umpire even made the move to signal it. I then watched in awe as my father noted the shift in the outfield for Counsell and two seconds later he lined out to the outfielder who had to move one step to his left to make the play. As the game wound down to the final innings, I realized that I was in heaven. It was a great sunny California day and I was watching baseball with my family. Nothing better! As the eighth inning ended and my parents got up to help my grandparents start to leave, I realized that this would be the last time the three of us would be sitting at Dodger Stadium together. I think my mother noticed first, though because she was teary eyed. My grandfather has announced that because of his age and his lack of mobility, this will be his last season to attend Dodger games in person. I know he has one more game to go but I am not sure my father and I can attend it together. It was wonderful having the two of them there with me. We all stood up, hugged, said our good-byes and my family left just before the ninth inning I stayed until the end. I am glad I did. We were sitting with a man who had bought a scalped ticket. As my family left, he shook my dad's hand and my grandfather's hand. He then told us we had something truly special. As my family walked down the concourse and I lost sight of them, I turned back to our new friend to see him on his cell phone, calling his father back in New York. The family that sat behind us were two kids probably around 7 and 5. Both boys with their father who took them to get a program. When he came back he told me he got the programs for his kids so "they would remember the day their dad took them to the ballpark and would hopefully have memories like the ones my family has." As the game ended, I sat in the stands and talked baseball with the guy in front of my and the family behind. None of wanted to leave. Security finally asked us to leave. I walked to my car and could not drive home. I spent twenty minutes looking at the L.A. skyline. Finally, I managed to drive home. I vowed to watch more games at home with my grandfather as much as possible. As well as going to games with my father. One day, I hope to take my children to games with their grandfather. I only hope I will be as good a baseball and life role model as they both were. I love them both. PS Who won the game? Arizona 7-5. Did I care? Not a damn bit!!! ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: A Plan For All MLB Fans To Consider Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 08:19:07 -0400 From: "James Moleta" I received this email from a baseball trivia website that I visit. See what you think of the plan... >From: webmaster@netshrine.com >To: james_moleta@hotmail.com >Subject: A Plan For All MLB Fans To Consider >Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 18:56:33 -0400 (EDT) >As a baseball fan, please read and consider the proposed plan (which >follows below) to use if there should be a work stoppage in Major League >Baseball (MLB). >Further, please forward this note (via e-mail), to every baseball fan that >you know, with the hope that the message gets to as many fans as possible. >Please consider forwarding the note even if you do not agree with the plan, >as perhaps others may find the plan to be something which they will want to >adopt (given a work stoppage). Thank you in advance for your time and >attention to this note and request. >For every one day that there is a work stoppage in MLB this year (and next, >if it carries over), please consider imposing a monthly personal sanction >back at baseball (once they start playing again). >One month for every day. >Example: If they're out for 18 days, that's 18 months - or 1.5 years, if >you prefer. >What will be the punishment? It will be a combination of steps taken during >the "penalty period": >1. Do not personally attend any major league games - do not buy tickets or >accept tickets provided by an organization who purchased them for >distribution to others. >2. Do not purchase any merchandise authorized and/or sold by MLB. >3. Refuse to watch any nationally televised MLB games (on ESPN, FOX, etc.). >Because you are a fan, you should still follow baseball - but only on local >TV and radio stations, the Internet, etc. Thus, being sure to hit MLB where >they feel it the most: >1. Attendance >2. Merchandising. >3. Ratings on National TV Coverage >If you want to see a game in person, go to a Minor or Independent League >game. Buy only their merchandise as well. >Unless baseball fans send the message to MLB (both the owners and players) >that we will not tolerate their inconsiderate attitude towards fans, we are >doomed to experience this mistreatment over and over again. >Granted, a proposed plan such as this requires a certain measure of >personal sacrifice by each fan. However, think of it as giving away an At >Bat in the 7th inning by laying down a bunt to advance a runner. It's a >"personal" concession at the time; but, in the bigger "team" picture (that >game, that series, or that season) that one transitory sacrifice just very >well may be an extremely important piece of a championship puzzle. >Applying the notion to this action - yes, it may be less than pleasurable >to "personally" commit to a sanction of this nature for "x" amount of time. >Still, again, in the big "fan" picture (all future years of baseball fans) >it may be an important part of ensuring that the fans are never abused >There's an old line which comes to mind here and is true - - everyone wants >to go to heaven, but nobody wants to die. >One must often give to receive in life. One month for every day. Please >consider the plan and pass this note to all your fellow baseball fans. >Thank you. >========================== >A Celebration of Baseball Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:03:41 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: My previous post AFTER I read Josh's post From: "jmoleta30341" First of all, I wish I could have been there with Josh and his family, watching the game! The story caused me to reminisce about my family and our love of baseball. My grandfather (mom's dad) would come down to GA from NJ, and spend countless time throwing the baseball with Matt (my younger brother) and me in our backyard. He loved to talk baseball with us and about the Yankee clubs he watched growing up, especially because of all the Italians the Yankees had (Lazzeri, Dimag, Rizzuto, Berra, etc.) My dad is also a big baseball fan. His father (who died when I was 2) was a semi-pro ballplayer for many years, playing against Babe Ruth as well as negro league teams with such barnstorming clubs as the House of David and the Detroit (or was it Indianapolis?) Clowns. My dad was also an exceptional ballplayer - a catcher - growing up, until a collision at home plate in college resulted in him needing serious knee surgery, which essentially ended his career. We used to attend many Braves games when Matt and I were kids, and these were during the "lean years" of the Braves getting pounded and the crowds hovering around 6,000 fans. I never wanted those games to end, and when they did it made me ask, to paraphrase Ernie Banks, "can't they play 2?" My dad also traveled a lot for work while we were growing up, and he always brought Matt and me souvenirs from Milwaukee, St Louis, Anaheim or wherever business would take him. He even grabbed former and current ballplayers in the airports or on the golf courses to secure their autographs for one or both of his boys (I've still got a ton!) These are still cherished moments in time. I, like Josh, wish I could say I evolved into the player my dad was, but Matt was gifted with my dad's baseball genes, so I had to be content to be a mediocre player but an avid student of the game, which I still am to this day. Which brings me to my second point: after I posted the email proposing a "plan" to react to baseball's impending work stoppage, I came to the Ramblings server to catch up on posts, and saw Josh's post. I felt awful for following Josh's beautiful story with an email that suggested a plan for preventing such moments as Josh and his family were able to experience. Were it not for baseball, many wonderful memories that Josh, surely many of you, and I have would not exist. But as I verbalize these thoughts, I also see even more clearly how awful another work stoppage will be. I remember how out of control the players' salaries are, compared to the working men and women in America. I remember Bud Selig. I remember the All-Star game fiasco (I've been silent about it till now, only because I couldnt even bring myself to watch it this year.) I remember contraction talks. I remember the Strike in '94. Sadly, despite the fact that I love baseball so much, and have so many great memories, there are a lot of things going wrong in baseball today. I hope that a stoppage is averted, but in the event that it is not, I for one will bite the bullet and "take some time off", watching baseball on TBS (local for me) or on the internet, to have my "lover" (hope my wife doesnt read this!) consider the consequences for mistreating me, the baseball fan. Phew! We now return you to your regularly scheduled Ramblings ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 10:01:26 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Fwd: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Fwd: A Plan For All MLB Fans To Consider From: Originaleek@webtv.net From: OriginalEEK@webtv.net (Earl Kilbourn) Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 08:43:27 -0400 (EDT) To: james_moleta@hotmail.com (James Moleta) Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Fwd: A Plan For All MLB Fans To Consider ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:22:42 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Fwd: A Plan For All MLB Fans To Consider To: james_moleta@hotmail.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com I like the plan also however, we will never get the fans to go along with it. The reality is that large corporations will simply buy the tickets we leave behind and give them to employees and clients and write the cost off! I wish it would work but it want. ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:34:55 -0400 (EDT) To: tply@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Fwd: A Plan For All MLB Fans To Consider From: Originaleek@webtv.net I think it's already working, check attendance at ballparks since the last strike. Many fans are staying away. Baseball can't survive on just Corporate sales alone. I say the average fan can make a big difference. Besides if / when the game dies I want to tell my grandchildren that I did my part to help save it instead of standing by and saying "woe is baseball, too bad somebody doesn't do something". Well, we are We keep what we give away! ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:46:56 EDT Subject: RE: something for all baseball fans to consider To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- i read about the proposed plan to get back at baseball because of a strike- You guys can do what you want but nothing is going to stop me from rooting for my Yankees- i supported their sorry losing efforts in the late 60's and early 70's when i was growing up in Elmhurst,Queens NYC and i remember what my father told me -" WE all support Mantle and our Yankees- No Exceptions!"- Win, Lose (or Strike) - Go Yankees!! ---Linda ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 15:31:04 EDT Subject: National Blues! To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com All - I have come to sad realization that I will probably not be able to attend the National in Chicago this year. I know I will be missing a great time and hate the thought of missing out. David will be a great host and he has even gone to the trouble of insuring the best chef in OBC will be at the barbecue at his house! I know I will miss the viewing of the new "Baseball Card Vault" at his new house as I had the good fortune of seeing the first one at his old house! I have to travel to Hawaii the week of the 22nd of July for more antiterrorist war games similar to the war games we conducted in Tahoe last month (it is a tough job but someone has to do it :-)). Margaret and I also have a trip to New York City planned for September and we will have to travel to her parents in Milwaukee soon as the family says her father is not doing well at all. I hold out a glimmer of hope that we can combine the trip to Milwaukee with the time of the National if Margaret can get the time off. I now hope that someone in OBC that will be attending the National will step up to the plate and help me out. Every National I have attended I have searched for those rare Mother's Cookies cards especially the 1952 and 1953 sets and have been pretty successful finding some from my wantlist. If someone would be willing to look for me I will be happy to send my complete Mother's Cookie wantlist via email and will send a $500.00 (probably less that I would spend if I attended in person) money order in over night mail to cover buying any you may find for me. I realize that the chance of finding enough to spend $500.00 on these rare cards may not be possible and I would welcome any old cards you find at good prices to replenish my dupes box. I would also expect the person to take a finders fee from the money I send to cover your time and trouble. If you are willing to help me out please email me and I will send the wantlist ASAP along with the money. Another Baseball Quote: "A base hit meant more to (Cap) Anson than a week's pay." ---------Grantland Rice Tripleplay (Rick) ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 16:18:09 EDT Subject: 1956 Topps Singles To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smart1853@aol.com I came upon an eBay seller offering what looks to be most of the 1956 Topps set. He has listed 197 singles and then 2 lots of cards. Many of the stars are there: Mantle, Mays, Aaron, Koufax, Berra, Aparicio, etc. I am winning one of his lots currently but have no interest in the other cards. If anyone is looking for singles, including high numbers and checklists, you might want to browse through. Most are in VG, VGEX, or EX condition. Might be good for anyone real close. The auctions all end in about 6 hours. 1956 Topps http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems& --Brian Dwyer ================= To: Subject: See you later... Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 15:42:18 -0700 From: "Geno Wagner" OBCers -- I'm outta here for three weeks to go to a class in San Antonio. I'll catchup when I get back... Take Care, Geno ================= To: , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Rick's Web Page Mirror Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 17:02:38 -0700 From: "AL Cummings" I updated Rick's Wantlist Page and posted it here: http://home.earthlink.net/~alcattle/_wsn/page2.html If you send other cards or know of any he has now, let me know so I can update the mirror site. Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:17:31 EDT Subject: upcoming LA vacation To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: amcook93@aol.com My family is travelling to LA at the end of the month to take the kids to CA for the first time. While both my wife and I are native Californians, for one reason or another our kids have never been there. We'll be staying at my parents' house in Palos Verdes. Can anyone get together sometime during the week of Monday, July 29 - Friday, August 2? I'll probably have a car. Let me know, ================= Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 23:09:36 EDT Subject: 1968 project To: OBC-Ramblings@Yahoogroups.com From: malsman250@cs.com My neighbor Fred needs only 7 cards to finish his 1968 set, and most of them are not too tough. He has some dupes in the 68-71 era that he could trade. Can anyone help out with these cards? We will do our best to return cards of similar value, hopefully on your lists. If this works, he also has short lists for 70 and 71 6 NL home run leaders 470 Freehan 490 Super Stars 505 Sparma 527 Francona 530 Bird Belters 531 Hinton Thanks for your help, Bill Malson ================= Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:38:10 -0400 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: vacation time From: bdangelo@aol.com Hi gang, I am off on vacation for the next 10 days, heading to several places in the Midwest, Northeast and Canada. So if you don't hear any thanks right away for anything sent, don't worry. I will catch up when I return. ================= To: "VCT" , Subject: '77 stars Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 17:43:08 -0400 From: "John Collins" I have the following 3 '77 stars available for trade: 140 Schmidt 390 Winfield 650 Ryan I would say condition averages ex. Let me know if you are interested, John C. Collins ================= Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 18:10:53 EDT Subject: 52 Topps packs and box To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- there is a seller on ebay who has a pic of a 52 Topps box and packs- i don't think i have ever seen a pic of a box with packs- ebay # 1843968240-- eBay item 1843968240 (Ends Jul-21-0217:... - Wow- Would i like to win this pack- may have hi #'s- Linda ================= Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 10:10:08 EDT Subject: a bit morbid To: Smartalecx@aol.com From: smartalecx@aol.com (overheard at wrigley field last night, where the cubs demolished the supposed best team in baseball, 3-2). the reason they didn't hand out the ted williams mvp award at the all star game is that he wasn't yet frozen enough. turns out, the winner will actually take ted home for a year, much like the stanley cup. hey folks, i don't write the news, i just report it. ================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: directory help -- again Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 07:41:47 -0700 From: "jcollins12" Can someone tell me if there is a version of the OBC directory that is more recent than 6/2/2002, and if so send it to me? As usual, I am looking for certain addresses and not finding them on the version I have. Sorry to be a pain, ================= Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:53:41 EDT Subject: 7 Vintage availables + a trader To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- i have these availables- Red Heart - Billy Pierce=G with crease but no scuffs, writing ,tears,trim- a nice type card for someone who doesn't have one 1933 Goudey # 68- Horace Lisenbee-Buffalo Bisons-International League- one of those minor leaguers in this set- 1950 Bowman # 123- Dino Restelli- nice name for a player that obviously dates him from the 50's-any player have a name like that today in the Majors? 1951 Bowman # 129- Matt Bates- Red Sox ( i know him as a Tiger in my 52 topps set) 1952 topps # 220- Joe Presko-nice 52 topps with some creases but no writing , scuffs , tears, trim, - back clear and readable 1953 Topps # 204- Dick Bokelmann-a few creases but no damage and very nicely centered- 1959 topps hi # 538- Chick King-O/C- L to R How about one for a trade-1953 topps hi # 237- Clarence Podbielan- crease but very nicely centered and clean front and back- What do you have from my want list?- ================= Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 07:43:44 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Maxwell & Friends From: Originaleek@webtv.net A huge Thanks goes out to JOHN MCLAUGHLIN for sending back (?) a 62 Post, Maxwell. This looks suspiciously in better shape then the one I think I gave him at our recent Tiger outing and tour of the Mike Rich Baseball Museum. John also sent 4 Hi #'s from that pesky 63T set bringing it into single digits. Thanks a whole bunch John, much We keep what we give away! ================= To: Subject: Dis 'n Dat Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:19:25 -0700 From: "Grant Rainsley" I have no idea where this is going to go, so if you are pressed for time, just hit Delete. Took the afternoon off to go to a "nooner" today...glad I did....saw 8 innings of a no-no....okay, it's just Single A (Northwest League), but it was cool just the same. The Vancouver Canadians were playing the Everett AquaSox..strange name...anyways, had to leave after 8, but heard Everett got their first hit in the 10th, so it almost counts as a no hitter for me. The stadium is really cool...I almost grew up there as a kid, watched the AAA Mounties first (around '58), including a kid named Brooks Robinson (who wasn't here long!)....my friend and I used to bicycle up there when there was nothing to do and ask to go out to clean up the field, picking up Popsicle sticks and gum and stuff....it became lucrative when we discovered that you could find coins under the bleachers, and then we'd head to the store to buy cards with our new wealth. Today's visit brought back a ton of memories. Like the time a pop foul landed just behind me on the tray of popcorn the vendor was carting around his neck...popcorn was flying everywhere...it was great. The organist (Doris Miller) was way up in the back row...nice lady, she always chatted up the kids when she wasn't busy. I used to pick up some cash by baby sitting way back then ('60's), and one of my customers was a Doctor...turned out he was the stand-in Vancouver Mounties Dr., so he used to take his 3 kids and myself to the odd games...if he got called away on an emergency, I had to find a way to get the kids home. Managed to get into the dugouts on occasion...I still clearly remember Nate Oliver hurting his neck in one game...and I got to carry the Doctor's bag into the locker room. Walt (No-neck) Williams was another customer one Back to the Stadium for a minute...it used to be called Capilano Stadium then, but has since been renamed Nat Bailey Stadium after the man who brought the Mounties to Vancouver....he also owned a chain of restaurants called White Spot (remember that Big Al ???)....it's built into the hillside of a beautiful city park....my family didn't have a lot of money back then, so Dad used to take me to the park and we would sit up on the hill overlooking the stadium watching the game for free....it's all overgrown now, nowhere left to watch for nothing...they used to call it Scotsman's Hill, for obvious reasons...(Glenn, you relate to that.) In 1959 or '60 I went down the hill to the stadium where all the kids hung out hoping for homers or fly balls...I almost got killed by a home run hit by Jackie Collum, who was a pitcher, but also a very good hitter, who had been brought in to pinch hit. I got the ball, then got mugged and lost it. (heck I was only about 8 or 9.) If you want to have a look at the place I almost called home, go to www.canadiansbaseball.com and take a 360 degree view. It is one cool old stadium, built in the early '50's. Okay, this has turned into a tome, and I haven't even started on our recent Savary Island Saga yet....I'll keep this part short. A couple of years ago we cleared one lot by hand, and it almost killed us both...broken leg, bruises, etc. This time, I cleared the other lot with three very simple tools, and we are now ready to start building our shack. The tools? A lawn chair, a 6-pack, and a little man with a backhoe. He did what took us 3 years to do in less than 3 hours, for under 200 bucks. I may be getting smarter as I get older. I'm tired now....you probably are too....Grant ================= To: Subject: Minor News Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 19:56:41 -0500 From: "Michael or Alexis Wierzbicki" Hi, Gang! I have been relatively inactive over the last few weeks, and wanted to let the group know of my situation. I am in the process of becoming DepartmentChair (I am a psychologist on the faculty of Marquette University in Milwaukee). As a consequence, I have been moving offices, working with the outgoing Chair on the transition, and beginning to process way too much paper work. One of my friends joked that I can now wear the scarlet letter A (for administrator, not what you were thinking). In any case, I will likely be less active in the group for the next few months, until I settle into the responsibilities of the new position. Mike W. ================= Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 23:08:44 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Dis 'n Dat To: grains@dccnet.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com In a message dated 7/17/2002 4:20:35 PM Pacific Daylight Time, grains@dccnet.com writes: > www.canadiansbaseball.com Grant - Great "Ramblings" and a great site! If the MLB players go on strike I might just start watching and attending minor league ball however, I will not promise anything here because as a member of OBC I am a FANATIC and love the game at the best level available! Let us all hope the strike doesn't happen meanwhile I promise to get back in touch with minor league ball, thanks for reminding me of the many games in Savannah I attended while growing up. Josh's recent "Rambling" about attending a ball game with his father, grandfather and other family members also reminded me of my childhood and my many wonderful time at the ball yard with my family! ================= To: "Ramblings \(OBC\)" Subject: 52T Mays up for bid - trimmed Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 21:15:26 -0700 From: "Geordie Calvert" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item1843916401 ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" Subject: ebay photo Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:11:01 -0400 From: "John Collins" http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item1844463183 This is currently the most expensive Ted Williams item listed on ebay. Trynot to laugh. I e-mailed the seller to ask about the price and item (and to tell him what I thought of it) and received a nice little reply filled with Sometime earlier we had a discussion on this server about people trying to profiteer from the death of famous athletes. I think some of the items in the DK case weren't about that, but this clearly is. John C. Collins ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:22:41 EDT Subject: good riddance To: Smartalecx@aol.com From: smartalecx@aol.com i was looking at my "trading only" 02 set today, particularly some of the stars. as i looked at these stars, all the sudden, i got really pissed off. these guys are on these cards because of fans like us. the act like a bunch of spoiled rotten babies, which really is what they are. if they can't agree to a revenue sharing arrangement where the economics of baseball can be brought back into reality (if the nfl and nba can do it, why not mlb), then to hell with them! go on strike! go on strike for years if you have to -- by that time, the existing crop of whining ingrates will be too old to play, and we can get some players in there who realize how lucky they are, and are willing to be realistic in their salary demands. and at the same time, the big market owners, who really perpetuate the problem, can get a real life where their egos dont blind them to the economic realities of the game. will i miss my tickets at wrigley -- of course. thats the price, as a fan, i am willing to pay to get this thing back to normalcy. i just hope i wont have to see selig on tv every day. excuse the rant! gm ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:07:49 EDT Subject: Revenue Sharing? Contraction? To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jdelott@aol.com I'd like to throw out a point here regarding the complaint that revenue sharing is needed to stop the Yankees and a few other teams from dominating the sport. Why is revenue sharing needed now as opposed to any other time in baseball? Where were those cries during the other Yankee dynasties? The Yankees have had greater financial resources throughout most of their history. Isn't that why Boston has a curse for selling the Babe? Perhaps there was no outcry at earlier times because there were fewer teams who were located in markets that could support them? Moreover, if those markets did not support them, they moved to a market that did. I don't think revenue sharing is the answer; rather, I think contraction is the better alternative. Prior to the 1950s what teams were west of the Mississippi? Contraction would also solve the problem of what many perceive to be watered down talent. Imagine if there were only 18 or 20 teams again, and half the players were sent to the minors. Wouldn't each team be far more competitive than now? Wouldn't there be less moving around of players as a result? There would be fewer places to go to for one thing. Wouldn't there be less incentive to keep escalating salaries as the "talent divide" would be smaller? In other words, if the remaining players are closer in skills to one another, there is no reason to pay most players much more than another. It's unrealistic to think that contraction would reduce the league in half, but I think it would be a much better game if it did happen. ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:16:12 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Revenue Sharing? Contraction? To: JDelott@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com jeff: i believe the reason it wasn't an issue before was because of the collusion among owners to keep salaries in line. in essence, that's what revenue sharing is, but its legal. contraction is certainly an option, but what's wrong with spreading the game to less than major markets? it was just 40 years ago there were 16 teams in the major leagues. was that a good thing, or is the game more popular now on a national basis with twice that number? i suspect the latter. that isn't to say that some current franchises wont survive, and maybe there aren't enough cities to support all the teams. but wholesale contraction isn't the answer either. if they get rid of MN and MONT this year, it will be TB and FLA in a year or two, KC and even PHX after that, and so on, and so on. maybe that's for the good, but i think i little fiscal sanity on all sides could keep the current game strong. ================= To: smartalecx@aol.com obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: baseball's problems Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:17:47 -0700 From: "jcollins12" Sorry guys, but I can't help but throw my two cents in here. Actually, by the end of this ramble, it may be a whole dollar: The revenue sharing idea is kind of a mixed bag. The perceived problem that necessitates revenue sharing is the supposed "competitive imbalance" that we have been hearing about for so long, and owners of smaller market teams crying out that their teams will never be able to win because they don't any money. Okay, somewhat true. When teams like the Yankees and Cubs (baseball's two biggest TV contracts) rake in over $50 million in TV revenues alone compared to the $5 or 6 million or so that the Pittsburg Pirates bring in, yes this kind of smacks of an imbalance. The ability of small market teams to win as of late has also diminished in some noteable instances. The Kansas City - New York rivalry in the AL during the 80's is completely dead. Nobody expects the Royals to get anywhere close to the playoffs, blaming it on "small market." The same with Cincinatti, whose "small market" Reds were a dynasty in the '70s and won the World Series as recently as 1990, but now stay in the headlines only because of whatever muscle Griffey pulled today. (The fact that they are currently in 2nd place in the NL Central is encouraging, but the are only 4 games over .500). Clearly the small market teams could "compete" back then, but that was an era in which free agency, though certainly growing exponentially, was not to the level of contract dollar absurdidty it is at now. However, things have not gone totally the other way, with certain other small market teams like Seattle and even the nearly extinct Twins this year, proving that they can still be contenders. Seattle obviously has done much more than that in setting the win record. I suggest that is is not completely the competitive imbalance, but also the "superstar imbalance" that is behind part of the owner's revenue sharing pleas. Maybe the Cubs are still perpetually in fourth place, but they have Sosa and McGriff, and management knows they could field a little league team and still sell out Wrigley. They can afford superstars and not care whether they win or not. If the other smaller market teams can't have superstars -- then they had better win to be popular and draw crowds, right? But then how do you win? Get superstars, of course !! .....it is a never ending cycle. I do believe that some revenue sharing has to occur. Baseball is not like any other big business, where Bank A's job is to put Bank B out of business. If the Yankees keep getting richer and richer and better and better, that is fine, but it doesn't do them any good if other teams go bankrupt and fold, there will be no one left for them to play !! That is why it is called a "league" instead of a "cutthroat marketplace." I agree that if Football and Basketball have done this already, then it is time for MLB to step up and take it's medicine as well. I was going to comment further on contraction, but realize that this is already way way too long. If you are still reading, congratulations. Just hope the players don't strike so we can focus most of our rambles on things more exciting than this crap (like actual baseball) !! >--- Original Message --- >From: smartalecx@aol.com >To: JDelott@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com >Date: 7/18/02 10:16:12 AM jeff: i believe the reason it wasn't an issue before was because of the >collusion among owners to keep salaries in line. in essence, that's what >revenue sharing is, but its legal. >contraction is certainly an option, but what's wrong with spreading the game >to less than major markets? it was just 40 years ago there were 16 teams in >the major leagues. was that a good thing, or is the game more popular now on >a national basis with twice that number? i suspect the latter. that isn't >to say that some current franchises wont survive, and maybe there aren't >enough cities to support all the teams. but wholesale contraction isn't the >answer either. >if they get rid of MN and MONT this year, it will be TB and FLA in a year or >two, KC and even PHX after that, and so on, and so on. maybe that's for the >good, but i think i little fiscal sanity on all sides could keep the current >game strong. ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:00:05 EDT Subject: Re: baseball's problems To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com john: as a long suffering cubs fan, and a baseball fan as well, i would like to do my part to help the superstar imbalance by generously offering fred mcgriff to any small market or minor league team that would like to have him! no need to thank me! gm ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 21:14:43 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: good riddance From: "pearceg2" smartalecx@aol.com wrote: >the [players] act like a bunch of spoiled rotten babies, which >really is what they are. Why do you think that? In every round of labor negotiations, it's the *owners* who want to take more money from the players.... not the other way around. It's the owners who violate labor law, refuse to bargain in good faith, lie to Congress and fans, and attempt to extort millions from city tax coffers. Not the players. They merely want to keep the system that lets the market determine player salaries. I'm just always interested in why public sentiment is so vehemently >if they can't agree to a revenue sharing arrangement where the >economics of baseball can be brought back into reality (if the nfl >and nba can do it, why not mlb), ... The NFLPA was basically crushed by the owners during their failed strike in 87 (?). The NBA ushered in their salary cap during a time when the league was really in financial distress and they did something Selig has not done.... namely opening the books to an independent audit by the players. The NBAPA auditor confirmed that the losses were legitimate and that the league was in financial problems. Selig merely references his Blue Ribbon Panel report commissioned by MLB telling everyone "All you need to know is in there." He has done nothing to prove that any team is having money The MLBPA is much stronger than any of the other sports union and the players have more common financial interests than the owners. That's why they've been so successful in laborr negotiations. Well, that and the fact that most of the negotiating tactics used by the owners wouldn't win on a middle school playground much less in front of lawyers and judges. ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:49:05 -0700 To: John Collins Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] ebay photo From: Seems others agreed with your thoughts as the item is gone On Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:11:01 -0400 John Collins href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1844463183">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1844463183 This is currently the most expensive Ted Williams item listed on ebay.  Try not to laugh.  I e-mailed the seller to ask about the price and item (and to tell him what I thought of it) and received a nice little reply filled with profanity.  Sometime earlier we had a discussion on this server about people trying to profiteer from the death of famous athletes.    I think some of the items in the DK case weren't about that, but this clearly is. John C. Collins Yahoo! Groups Sponsor href="http://rd.yahoo.com/M=228862.2128520.3581629.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705123920:HM/A=1155066/R=0/*http://adfarm.mediaplex.com/ad/ck/990-1736-1039-302" To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:16:36 EDT Subject: reconstruct a Perez Rookie- To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi this is Linda- i was in a card store today when a guy brought in some cards to sell- What he did to some of his cards and his rationale what i will call "scissors philosopohy" on a rare rookie card can make an OBCer cry- Apparently this guy had some 65 topps Hi's and some 68 topps which he said were of stars- He offered a Perez Rookie 65 # 581 to the card shop owner BUT it was cut in half- i asked why did he cut the card in half- He said because Perez is the only star player on the card- He cut off the right half of the card and threw it away because it contained players which he thought would lessen the value of the card- Kevin Collins and Dave Ricketts- if any OBCer has this card Perez is on half of the card and i assume the other 2 players are on the other half which he cut off and threw away- Naturally the shop owner told him cards cut in half are worthless after which the owner of the cards said something i can't repeat here and threw them up in the air like confetti and left the store- the store owner quickly retrived a half of a certain 68 topps card- i will let you guess which one- guess the owner of the card thought by removing Koosman the card would be more valuable- (scissors philosopohy!) - i retrived the Perez Rookie card half- if anyone needs a Perez rookie 65 hi # 581 SP and will settle for only half the card let me know- maybe you can get a computer image of the missing half and reconstruct the card- i have never seen any one with cards who cut off parts of the cards with lesser known players thinking the value would be increased by having half a card with only a star on it- SAD!!!! -- Linda ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:29:40 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] baseball's problems To: jcollins12@triad.rr.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jdelott@aol.com In a message dated 7/18/02 4:19:31 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jcollins12@triad.rr.com writes: << jcollins12@triad.rr.com >> I guess one false or overblown issue is the big market versus small market. Baltimore is not a large market. I'm not sure if it is even in the top half, but it has a large payroll and has been profitable, although the new stadium must receive some credit. At the same time, that large payroll hasn't always paid dividends. So while a larger market and TV contract may contribute towards a larger profit and funding for a payroll, it's not a requirement. Haven't Seattle and Arizona been successful without being a big market? If Bill Gates or a well funded corporate consortium bought the Royals, wouldn't it have the same funding available to compete? Isn't that what transpired in Baltimore and Florida/Arizona? In short, mandating profit sharing to compensate for market size disparity seems wrong. It's arguably un-American. I would draw the parallel to the one-man one-vote concept which is the basis to our democracy. If 1 out of 5 Americans live in the NY and LA metro areas, and support their teams, wouldn't it be reasonable to hope to win at least 1 out of every 5 years? Does anybody buy that last point? ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Re: good riddance Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:46:36 -0400 From: "John Collins" I appreciate your points, but I hope you are being sarcastic. If you really think the players are being perfect little angels during this whole fiasco, then think again. Don't get me wrong, I'm no fan of the owners, who have bascially run baseball like feudal lords ever since the beginning of timeand will continue to do so if they are allowed to. But the players have become greedy, there is no denying that. "The system that lets the market determine player salaries" has gone from a novel idea to a leach on the premise of a true league structure and competitive balance. They (the players) went from being total victims prior to free agency,to spoiled brats in the year 2002. How much is a salary cap or luxury taxgoing to hurt the game? It's not like it would be a LOW salary cap, the player's union and Mr. Fehr wouldn't stand for that for a second. They would strike until rapture and we would have no more major league baseball in the U.S. A starting cap would probably be somewhere in the realm of slightly higher than what Mr. Bonds is currently knocking down per year right now -- and then it would get raised every year to the point that in 30 years, the wealthiest player in the game will make Bill Gates look like a pauper. And as for the revenue sharing issue, while I agree that it's not the end of the world if a few teams flounder in futility as has occured historicallyin baseball, it is getting to a ridiculous state of affairs when it becomes a given that well less than half of MLB's 30 teams are competitive from the word go. The Yankee arrogance and wealth dominance is nearing a cresendo, and it is getting downright obcence. Does anyone doubt who the AL representative in this year's World Series (if played) will be? My point in blaming the players is that THEY more than any faceless owner, to the fans, are the caretakers of the game. They are the ones who go out and make the magic happen. And it is THEY who should realize their responsiblity to the game and the dire necessity that it continue this year without a strike. Does anyone realize this responsibility? No, instead you haveBonds being quoted as saying that the game is entertainment like anything else, and the fans will come back no matter what. What is he smoking? That kind of attitude is arrogance completely untempered by common sense. Theplayers union is one of, if not the single strongest labor organization inthe world. The minimum salary in the majors, for a 3rd string bullpen catcher, is $200,000 per year. From the early days of the century, through the '50s and '60s, the average major league ballplayer's salary was always about 7x that of the average American. In the 21st century, it is hundreds of times that of the average American. My point is simply that for the good of the game, the players should concede a slight bit. I'm sure PayRodand Sammy Sosa's families won't starve if they do. And while they are at it, they might just make the game a better and more interesting one to watch. My 2 cents for the day has become closer to $20 now.......and I hope I haven't offended anyone, but I just need to say it! John C. Collins ----- Original Message ----- From: pearceg2 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 5:14 PM Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] Re: good riddance smartalecx@aol.com wrote: >the [players] act like a bunch of spoiled rotten babies, which >really is what they are. Why do you think that? In every round of labor negotiations, it's the *owners* who want to take more money from the players.... not the other way around. It's the owners who violate labor law, refuse to bargain in good faith, lie to Congress and fans, and attempt to extort millions from city tax coffers. Not the players. They merely want to keep the system that lets the market determine player salaries. I'm just always interested in why public sentiment is so vehemently >if they can't agree to a revenue sharing arrangement where the >economics of baseball can be brought back into reality (if the nfl >and nba can do it, why not mlb), ... The NFLPA was basically crushed by the owners during their failed strike in 87 (?). The NBA ushered in their salary cap during a time when the league was really in financial distress and they did something Selig has not done.... namely opening the books to an independent audit by the players. The NBAPA auditor confirmed that the losses were legitimate and that the league was in financial problems. Selig merely references his Blue Ribbon Panel report commissioned by MLB telling everyone "All you need to know is in there." He has done nothing to prove that any team is having money The MLBPA is much stronger than any of the other sports union and the players have more common financial interests than the owners. That's why they've been so successful in laborr negotiations. Well, that and the fact that most of the negotiating tactics used by the owners wouldn't win on a middle school playground much less in front of lawyers and judges. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 21:47:58 EDT Subject: Available/Trade To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com I have a 1955 Topps Koufax #79 that is very well=centered with strong corners, but a couple of creases. It has a white back, and I need to trade it for a gray back card. Also, if anyone has not started a 1966 Topps or 1964 Topps set, I have some low number cards I would like to send you. Take care, ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:03:02 -0400 Subject: Mr.Parker??? To: OBC Ramblings From: Jimmy Parker It's official. Starting August 8th (when students return!) I will be the Art Teacher at Marlboro County High School here in Bennettsville, SC. I am really excited about and looking forward to this new challenge. Thanks to all you guys for your friendship and support during the past year (it's been a tough one!) and I hope it will continue as I realize I'll have an adjustment stepping into the shoes of an educator! I'm even going to have an 11th grade homeroom. There is also the possibility that I may be the new Soccer Coach. Wouldn't that be a trip? As much as I look forward to this, I may still be a little slow in OBC activity for the next month or so as I adjust to the world of academia, but at least I'll have my summers free, so I am now officially stating my intention to attend V03!!!! Maybe the National as well, who knows? Hope all is well with each of you. And send lesson plans! Take care, Save the gum for me... ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Aug 23 - M's vs. Tribe @ Cleveland Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:15:45 -0400 From: "Joe Isaac" Hello all, Bill Malson and I are planning a trip to the Jake on Friday August 23 to see the M's take on the Tribe. If anyone will be in N.E. Ohio this time, let either of us know - we will work out the details in the next few weeks. Let's hope there is no work stoppage. Have a great day everyone. Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:28:29 -0400 (EDT) To: catfishparkerad@earthlink.net (Jimmy Parker), Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Mr.Parker??? From: Originaleek@webtv.net Congrats! It's good to know that art is still taught in High School. The soccer gig would be too cool as well. Good Luck! We keep what we give away! ================= Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:47:49 EDT Subject: Correction To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com I typed 55 for the Topps Koufax I want to trade. Obviously, it is a 1956 in the white/gray back series. Thanks to John C. for keeping me straight. ================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Checklist help needed. Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:53:21 -0400 From: "Robert Reed" Hi all, I'm bringing my son and 8 of his friends to see the New Britain Rock Cats play the Trenton Thunder this Sunday for his 9th birthday. I checked out both rosters and found a few former players as coaches. Can somebody provide me with a checklist for the following players so I can give some cards to the kids for autographs? New Britain U.L. Washington 1977-87 Kansas City, Montreal, Pittsburgh Stu Cliburn 1984-88 California Angels Stan Cliburn 1980 California Angels Joe Mays Current Twins pitcher on a rehab assignment Ron Johnson 1982-84 Kansas City, Montreal Mike Griffin 1979-89 Yankees, Cubs, San Diego, Baltimore, Cincinnati Steve Braun 1971-85 Minnesota, Seattle, KC, Toronto, St. Louis Bob R. If Bob C. or anybody from Mass wants to meet up at the game let me know. It's Rocky the Rock Cat bobblehead day! Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ================= Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:14:07 EDT Subject: Re: ebay photo To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: cardclctor@aol.com In a message dated Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:11:01, "John Collins" writes: << http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1844463183 This is currently the most expensive Ted Williams item listed on ebay. Try not to laugh. I e-mailed the seller to ask about the price and item (and to tell him what I thought of it) and received a nice little reply filled with Sometime earlier we had a discussion on this server about people trying to profiteer from the death of famous athletes. I think some of the items in the DK case weren't about that, but this clearly is. >> I took a look at the auction and was describing it to my cousin in the next room when I realized... "Hey, for that much money, why should I settle for an autographed photo? I could probably buy TED HIMSELF!!" If I had the bucks, I'd pay that fool son of his and have his father's remains cremated like he intended... then maybe I'd sell them to Fleer and they could make some of those 'game used' cards we rambled about on this server before OK, my friends have come back into my white padded room with another long sleeved sweater for me to try on. TAYL, Ken M ================= Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:30:05 EDT Subject: Dealer Recommendation To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: brockhattox@cs.com I wanted to recognize Chandy G (chandyg@aol.com), who owns Season Ticket in Winston-Salem, is a friend of some of our members, and a seller on eBay. He let one of my checks sit for about a week, thinking it was a bill. As a result, he sent me the cards and refunded my money. I thought he was just making sure the check would clear. He has my recommendation as a good person to do business with. ================= Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 20:41:10 -0700 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Time running out From: Only one more day to buy that 52 Topps pack. Still at a low $6,100 but the reserve is not met so bid it up! Make Linda's Day! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1843968240 Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 22:35:12 -0700 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Misc. Availables From: Erik & Leticia Greenwood I have a stack available for each of the following: 1973 Topps Blue Checklists (Marked) - I think every team is represented in the pile 1974 Topps Red Checklists (Marked / Unmarked) - most teams available A few have writing; cutting quality varies 1976 Hostess - 8, 9, 19, 39, 67, 68, 72, 74, 77, 78, 80, 87, 91, 92, 95, 97, 99, 101, 105, 106, 107, 122, 123, 125, 126, 142, 145, 150 1977 Hostess - 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 13, 14, 15, 17, 18, 24, 25, 26, 27, 40, 43, 44, 46, 48, 50, 51, 52, 55, 58, 59, 60, 62, 70, 71, 72, 76, 78, 80, 83, 84, 85, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 103, 104, 105, 108, 109, 113, 114, 124, 131, 134, 135, 136, 139, 143, 145, 147 ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:28:43 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Dealer Recommendation To: Brockhattox@cs.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Wite3@aol.com In a message dated 07/19/2002 4:31:22 PM Pacific Daylight Time, brockhattox@cs.com writes: > I wanted to recognize Chandy G (chandyg@aol.com), who owns Season Ticket > in Winston-Salem, is a friend of some of our members, and a seller on eBay. > He let one of my checks sit for about a week, thinking it was a bill. > As a result, he sent me the cards and refunded my money. I thought he was > just making sure the check would clear. He has my recommendation as a > good person to do business with. > Brock I have to agree with Brock, I have purchased several cards from Chandy this year and have always been happy... ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 08:42:19 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Dealer Recommendation To: Wite3@aol.com, Brockhattox@cs.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: amcook93@aol.com I've purchased a couple dozen cards from Chandy on ebay and he's always been great. I think his id is chandyg ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 12:36:29 EDT Subject: Vacation... To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: XTrJmx@aol.com Hi all... I'm heading out of town for vacation with my family in a few minutes. They've been out east at my in-laws and I'm going to meet them for a few days at the beach in Topsail Island, NC. Never been there... looking forward to getting away from the stress of wondering whether my grant will come through. I'm woefully behind in getting thanks out for the tremendous envelopes and puffies of cards that have arrived here... hope to get better organized and caught up after vacation. Also hope to complete my tome titled "A Rookie Lagard's Final Report -- V '02", aka "Not Even Two Months Can Dim These Memories!". I'll be back Thursday at the earliest, Sunday at the latest depending on whether I drive up to my dad's place after I return from NC. I haven't had time to look on the map but if anyone in this great group is a local to the Topsail area, I'll have my cellphone with me (402-670-1402) and I always enjoy meeting members. Take care and have a great week... ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:41:02 EDT Subject: Uncle Sugar come through and I am headed to Chicago! To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com All - I just found out yesterday that I will be attending a conference in Chicago August 6 through August 9! I have added additional vacation time so that Margaret and I can visit her parents for the weekend we will be Milwaukee Saturday, August 10th and will return to San Francisco Wednesday, August 14th. While in Chicago for the conference I will be staying at the Holiday Inn 506 West Harrison Street, Chicago, IL. 60607 (312) 957-9100. I will also have my cell phone with me (510) 378-4666. I would love to catch a ride with someone to David's house for the barbecue and viewing of "The Vault" if anyone has room! I will be done with the conference on Friday around noon. I can meet anyone in the Chicago area if I know where and when. Please email me with your hotel information and phone numbers. I would like to thank Doug Smith and Kent Gotto for offering to shop for me while at the National. I am thrilled I will be able to do that for myself and get to see the group as well! If anyone is staying close to my hotel and will be attending the National please let me know and perhaps we can attend together. I look forward to hearing from anyone! Tripleplay (Rick) ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:54:01 EDT Subject: 1952 & 1953 Mother's Cookies on Ebay To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com All - For those of you interested in the 1952 and 1953 Mother's Cookies Ebay has a number of them listed right now including the hard to find Chuck Connors card! I have all of the ones listed right now so I will not be bidding. I am not sure what the reserve on the Connors card is but it is starting at $9.00 and it is probably worth 10X that! Tripleplay (Rick) ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 19:04:07 EDT Subject: Here's one for us To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jdelott@aol.com Item # 1844188275 is the ebay ID for a 1958 cut Ted Williams. Less than 2 days, no bids on the opening bid of $6. ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 16:38:34 -0700 To: jdelott@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Here's one for us From: Thanks Jeff, I will pick it up and put it in the freezer. Big Al in Seattle On Sat, 20 Jul 2002 19:04:07 EDT jdelott@aol.com wrote: Item # 1844188275 is the ebay ID for a 1958 cut Ted Williams. Less than 2 days, no bids on the opening bid of $6. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Access Your PC from Anywhere - Free Trial http://us.click.yahoo.com/o5uw2C/0ncEAA/Ey.GAA/QBiolB/TM To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 00:11:01 EDT Subject: Baeball Town USA To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: dsh46@aol.com well kids, we are back from points north, primarily cooperstown. i have to say i was a little disappointed the hof hasn't really been changed since my last visit 10 years ago. the exhibits need to be updated and there is very little interactive stuff. my son ryan, who is 8, was really into it at first but after we had lunch all he wanted to do was go to the gift shop (wonder where he gets that from?!). he picked up a vintage ny giants hat because he is amazed how it looks like the mets logo. i may have unleashed a future giants collector! he's way into collecting cards now too-pretty cool. the hof bookshop was nice-i got dickson's book on scoring and also a book called a picture postcard history of baseball by ron menchine that is fabulous. i also liked the world series ticket and press pin exhibit--although i don't think it's changed much over the years. it was fun to go and see everything but a hof upgrade is needed. and the cards they have on display, while nice (a wagner, some old tobacco, topps, bowman) seem like an afterthought. cooperstown itself is the usual tourist trap town, just in a really quaint, rural way. memorabilia was very expensive and unless you like vintage repros of caps, not much is worth buying. i will say that if you go, you should check out the national pastime store on main street--they have about a dozen display cases filled with great collectibles. there were a bunch of colgan's chips in their tins, tobacco packs, blankets, oodles of topps goodies and just a whole bunch of neat, old stuff i can't even begin to describe. it was like the front of standard catalog exploded and landed in this store! in a way, it was as nice as going to the hof although the prices were ridiculous. i know larry fritsch tried and failed with his bb card museum in cooperstown but a really well organized bb card museum in town would certainly draw. you just can't spend 3/4's of a million bucks like fritsch did for his place (that's late 80's dollars too) and hope it will succeed. we also hit the finger lakes (some wineries) and a couple other places but spent 2 days walking and visiting places in the village itself. my daughter allie just wanted to swin in the motel pool all day but was a trouper as we hiked around cooperstown on day 2. the weather was good for our whole trip though and the upstate ny scenery is beautiful. i'll be going back in a few years i'm sure--i just hope the hof has decided to join the 21st century by ================= Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 21:27:53 -0700 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Misc. Availables From: Erik & Leticia Greenwood > I will be sending out packages on Monday or Tuesday to all that have responded > to the message below. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Erik & Leticia Greenwood" > To: "OBC Ramblings" > Sent: Saturday, July 20, 2002 12:35 AM > Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] Misc. Availables > > I have a stack available for each of the following: > > > > 1973 Topps Blue Checklists (Marked) - I think every team is represented > > in the pile > > 1974 Topps Red Checklists (Marked / Unmarked) - most teams available > > > > A few have writing; cutting quality varies > > > > 1976 Hostess - 8, 9, 19, 39, 67, 68, 72, 74, 77, 78, 80, 87, 91, 92, 95, > > 97, 99, 101, > > 105, 106, 107, 122, 123, 125, 126, 142, 145, 150 > > > > 1977 Hostess - 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 13, 14, 15, 17, 18, 24, 25, 26, > > 27, 40, 43, 44, > > 46, 48, 50, 51, 52, 55, 58, 59, 60, 62, 70, 71, 72, 76, 78, 80, 83, 84, > > 85, 87, 88, 89, > > 90, 91, 92, 93, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 103, 104, 105, 108, 109, 113, > > 114, 124, 131, > > 134, 135, 136, 139, 143, 145, 147 > > > > > > Erik > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > OBC-Ramblings-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > > > > > > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ > > > > > > ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 02:14:42 EDT Subject: Lost a 53 Paige on local bid board To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- Today i suffered the frustration of being outbid on the local card shop bid board for a 53 topps Paige card- it went for $31- in VG condition----I probably would have bid over $50 for the same card had i seen it on ebay- - But i just don't like to pay as much for cards on the local card shops bid boards-a 53 campy in EX condition on the bid board today went for $30-More than i was willing to pay- i did win 12 1952 topps all for under $2 each including a Larry Doby----i also won 4 t-206 cards for 50 cents each including a non common- some guy named Willis- St. Louis Nat'l- batting pose-check the Beckett Vintage price guide or the SCD big book to see what that one books for- nice to get it for 50 cents-Also it was odd to see 2 1966 Tigers Team hi # 583 SP cards on the bid board - one guy asked me why i was bidding on both of them- i said for $1 each which is what i won them for i will bid on 20 of them if they want to put them up on the board- Linda ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 11:46:06 EDT Subject: The WORLD OF MINOR LEAGUE BASEBALL To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Celenox@aol.com Last Night My Son, My father and Myself went to a Minor league baseball game. The game was between the Hudson Valley Renegades and the Brooklyn Cyclones. These Tickets were given to me by Wayne Delia, who also attended the game with us. I dont know where to begin........ First of all let start by saying this was the first sporting event that My father, my son and I all attended together...so already it was starting to be the best day ever..... We got to the park and my wather was amazed how inexpensive things were....and how beautiful Dutchess stadium was....(he is use to MLB prices and stadiums in NY...LOL.... I picked up an Official Rawlings NY-Penn league ball for my son, and my 6 yr old son got almost the Entire Brooklyn Cyclones team to sign it...all on his own....he was amazed how many players signed for him.....he asked me "daddy howcome when we go to see the Mets or yankkes we cant get autographs like this" ....I told him Players are much nicer in this stadium.....I wasnt sure if a 6 year old could understand the concept of MLB players vs Minor leagers....so i left it at that.....I must admit......1 player kinda snuffed the fans, and the cyclones coach HOWARD JOHNSON dam near ripped him a NEw one and he came out and signed.....How awsome is that? Well as we headed back to our seats we met Wayne Delia who had already been conversing with my dad about sports....how great is OBC.....lol who came bearing more gifts for me...he handed me 10 1949 bowmans very unexpected, very unneccessary, but very appreciated...lol...... I think the best part of the game had to be this moment....My father went to have a smoke, and came back with beers for Wayne,Myself and himself, and the 3 of us chugged down a brew...great manly man bondage. OK now came the 5th inning and the little guy is alittle restless...so off to the play ground they had some nice little playground rides for the kids it kept him occupied while i watched the game for an inning or so..... Back to the seats...where wayne and me and dad conversed more about sports.....Just a great time all around.....I had the Time of my life it was the Best game ive ever been to.......WHO NEEDS the Majors when you have the Minors...PLayers sign players talk to you its a warm atmosphere and you just got to love it...you are really into the game in a minor league.... Oh by the way my Cyclones Lost 4-3 to the Renegades, but i dont think any of us were really paying attetion...the 3 big guys were more into the guy thing and talking sports....... THANX WAYNE ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 14:20:32 EDT Subject: 1952 Topps Stars and High Numbers on Ebay To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com All - Currently Ebay seller "irishhosta" has a lot of 1952 Topps Stars and High Numbers for sell on Ebay. I have purchased cards from this seller in the past and have been very please with all transactions. I am unable to bid on the current auctions the seller has listed because I will be traveling for the next three weeks. I thought some of you might be interested in looking at this sellers current ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 18:28:39 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Interesting ebay lot From: "airal6" Hey boys and girls, I seldom post to the ramblings server but I do read everyone's posts and I love this group. As a quick note, I am still on the fence for National but trying hard to make it happen. I hope to see you all there. The lot that I just saw on ebay is ebay #1845463515 and I have listed the seller's description below. If someone bids on it in the group, throw me some old basketball or football from the lot. [Finder's fee.] : ) I hope everyone is having a great summer. Al Crotte IF YOU LIKE VINTAGE CARDS THIS IS THE AUCTION FOR YOU!! CARDS FROM 1933 GOUDEY CARDS TO A 1956 TOPPS MICKEY MANTLE (HI BV $1400.00), THIS IS ONE OF THE BEST LOTS ON EBAY, AN INCREDIBLE COLLECTION LOADED WITH SUPER CARDS!! THIS LOT IS LOADED WITH VINTAGE PSA GRADED CARDS - NO JUNK CARDS! - AND EVEN A 1/1 MASTERPIECE ALEX RODRIGUEZ!! THE HIGHLIGHTS OF THIS AUCTION IS MANY WITH SOME LISTED BELOW.ONE PRICE GETS EVERYTHING!! THE COLLECTION IS ALL THREE SPORTS BUT ALOT OF BASEBALL AND VERY FEW BASKETBALL.I OFFER QUALITY LOTS AT GREAT PRICES.BELOW IS A SHORT LIST OF A FEW OF THE GREAT CARDS THE WINNING BIDDER WILL RECIEVE.DUE TO TIME AND SPACE I CANNOT LIST EVERY CARD.THE GOUDEY CARDS HAVE PINHOLES BUT STILL ARE VERY PRESENTABLE CARDS.THE WINNER PAYS $35.00 INSURED SHIPPING.HERE IS SOME HIGHLIGHTS: * 1956 TOPPS MICKEY MANTLE #135 (I WOULD GRADE THIS CARD VERY GOOD WITH NO CREASES - HI BECKETT VALUE $1400.00) * 1958 TOPPS WILLIE MAYS #5 PSA GRADED 5 EX (HI BV $200.00) * 2001 DONRUSS ALEX RODRIGUEZ 1/1 MASTERPIECE CARD(BEAUTIFUL CARD AND STAMPED CLEARLY 1/1!!) * 1953 BOWMAN GIL HODGES PSA 4 VG-EX (HI BV $200.00) * 1951 BOWMAN EARLY WYNN PSA 7 NEAR MINT(SHARP CARD!) * 1970 KELLOGGS JOHNNY BENCH PSA 8 NM-MT(BV $75.00) * 1989 UPPER DECK KEN GRIFFEY JR. PRO GRADED MINT 9 (BV $90.00) * 1933 GOUDEY BILL WALKER #94 (BV $80.00 - PINHOLE) * 1933 GOUDEY BERNIE FRIBERG #105 (BV $80.00 -PH) * 1933 GOUDEY BILLY HARGRAVE #172 (BV $80.00- PH) * 1933 GOUDEY PHIL TOOT #86 (BV $80.00- PH) * 2001 UPPER DECK LEGENDS KOBE BRYANT GAME-USED JERSEY CARD(BV $60.00) * 1933 GOUDEY JESS PETTY #90 (BV $80.00- PH) * 1933 GOUDEY JOE KUHEL #108 (BV $80.00- PH) * 1933 GOUDEY JOE MORRISSEY #97 (HI BV $80.00- PH) * 2001 SP GAME BAT BARRY BONDS GAME-USED BAT CARD(BV $30.00) * 2002 UPPER DECK SWEET SPOT DENNIS ECKERSLEY AUTOGRAPH(BV $40.00) * 2002 UPPER DECK PIECE OF HISTORY FRANK THOMAS GAME-USED JERSEY CARD * 2001 DONRUSS STUDIO SCOTT ROLEN GAME-USED JERSEY AND BAT * 2002 UPPER DECK SWEET SPOT STEVE GARVEY GAME-USED JERSEY CARD * 2002 FLAIR JIM EDMONDS GAME-USED JERSEY CARD * 2001 FLEER AUTHORITY KENNY LOFTON GAME-USED BAT CARD * 22002 UPPER DECK CARLOS DELGADO GAME-USED JERSEY CARD * THE LIST GOES ON ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:45:54 EDT Subject: The National To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: ChicoD1@aol.com Ok Boys, I'm in! My OS crashed on my other computer, but my trusty P200 laptop with the 28.8 modem helped make this happen. Even though it took hours to book on line! I'm arriving Wed early and leaving Sat nite. I may need some help on Sat, as I have to check out at 12 and my flight is 8:30. If anyone is getting a car, I'd appreciate storing my suitcase Sat until I have to leave for the airport (I wanted to maximize OBC and convention time). I guess I could grab a cab from the center to the airport later on. Do we have a list of the attendees to this major OBC event yet? I don't know how many dupes I'll be bringing (I plan on looking for a deal on a box of OBC specials at the show), but if anyone has any requests from my availables list, let me know and I'll make sure they come with me. I'll be staying at the Radisson O'hare on N. Manneheim (looks like a short cab ride to the center). Anyone else staying there? Hopefully I can get retrieve the info from the computer once I get a new harddrive this week. Of course my wantlists are on that computer :(. Should be a blast, too bad the Cubbies are on the road... ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 20:00:12 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] The National To: ChicoD1@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com Geno - I will probably rent a car on Thursday 8/8 or Friday 8/9 and will have room for you and your luggage however, if Margaret fly's in on Friday we may have to leave for Milwaukee on Saturday morning. I hope also to hear from others that are going and perhaps meet them at their hotel(s) for the trip to David's house on Friday. I also hope to drive (or ride with one of the conference attendees) out to Milwaukee Thursday night for a night game (I think they are playing the METs) with some friends at the conference. If any of you would like to go I welcome you however, I cannot promise I will have room to take many since I am pretty sure I will have a full car from the conference attendees. I may not have a car on Thursday (I have to see what kind of deal I can get for the weekend). In any event I am sure we will get together and I am pretty sure I can pick you up if no one else does that may be closer. My hotel is in the downtown area I think and may not be as close as others. I will be staying at the Holiday Inn 506 West Harrison Street, Chicago, IL. 60607 (312) 957-9100. ================= Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 23:03:15 EDT Subject: Fwd: National To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: tply@aol.com From: TPLY@aol.com Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 23:02:24 EDT Subject: Re: National To: TraderDoug@aol.com Doug - Thanks! Joel called me today and plans on picking me up Friday around noon when my conference ends and we will head to the National and then to David's after that. You might want to contact Geno, I think he is looking for a ride. ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: National question to anyone going Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 13:30:41 +0000 From: "Brad Chambers" Hi guys, It just occurred to me that I will be in Chicago the week of August 4-9. I have an active duty at Ft Sheridan that week, so would not be available until after 5 p.m. or so any evening and will be flying out Friday afternoon, but if anyone is there and wants to get together let me know. I'll be at the Woodfield Suites at Bannockburn, IL 847 317-7300. I won't be able to bring any cards....well maybe I can pack a few for trade, but would like to meet anyone interested. Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ================= Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 11:47:07 EDT Subject: National on Tuesday anyone? To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: t206guy@aol.com Greetings all. Are any of you guys planning on being at the national on Tuesday the 8th? That will be the only day that I have a chance to attend, however I would like to try and make the trip. Dupes box would be there with me including a new batch of T card dupes. I probably would arrive tuesday at opening and I would have to leave Wed AM but if there are going to be any OBCers there I would love to run into you. LMK if you plan on being there that early and we will keep an eye out for each other. I will be sporting my OBC hat in case you fail to recognize me from the posters in the post office. Hope to see about 100 of you there. ================= To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: still available Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 11:37:58 -0700 From: "jcollins12" The following cards never got claimed from a previous wavier wire post. They are available, first come, first serve: 1955 Topps: 1961 Topps: 5, 16 ,33, 83 1965 Topps: 28, 23, 27, 35, 37, 39, 59, 76, 77, 83(2),87, 90, 122, 237, 358, 568 -- would prefer to swap these for other 65's I still need (I have about 200 to go) -- but will send them out fcfs anyway. 1968 Topps: 34, 163, 206, 208, 224, 278, 286(2) 1977 Topps: 140 Schmidt (g-vg) 390 Winfield (g-vg) ================= Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 14:39:13 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Interesting ebay lot To: HeyAC@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: mikesportsfan@aol.com Lots like this scare me. Who in their right mind would combine in 1 lot, a 1956 Mantle and 2002 cards, let aline throwing in FB & BSKB cards. I did not check out the item on Ebay, so I do not know the Seller's rating or feedbacks, but I would not be surprised if this is some sort of scam. My thoughts. Mike Rich ================= Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 14:55:57 -0700 To: mikesportsfan@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Interesting ebay lot From: I was also leery of this one. Why didn't the seller put a total number of cards or some sense of the total value instead of listing a few cards? Too many good deals out there to gamble on this one. Big Al in Seattle On Mon, 22 Jul 2002 14:39:13 EDT mikesportsfan@aol.com wrote:        Lots like this scare me.  Who in their right mind would combine in 1 lot, a 1956 Mantle and 2002 cards, let aline throwing in FB & BSKB cards.  I did not check out the item on Ebay, so I do not know the Seller's rating or feedbacks, but I would not be surprised if this is some sort of scam.         My thoughts. Mike Rich Yahoo! Groups Sponsor href="http://rd.yahoo.com/M=228862.2128520.3581629.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705123920:HM/A=1155068/R=0/*http://adfarm.mediaplex.com/ad/ck/990-1736-1039-302" To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 19:13:31 -0400 To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com,vct@lists.vintagecardtraders.com Subject: Any PayPal Premiere/Business members out there? From: Dan Austin I'm contemplating upgrading my PayPal account. My big question is, do I have to pay the 2.9% + $0.30 fee for ALL payments if I do this, or only for credit card payments? Anyone out there who has a high end account that can shed some light on this? Dan Austin - dan@iamdanaustin.com Visit me at http://iamdanaustin.com "How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a good deed in a naughty world." - William Shakespeare ================= To: t206guy@aol.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [OBC-Ramblings] National on Tuesday anyone? Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 19:42:50 -0400 From: abaran@perriergroup.com I believe that the National is only open Thursday through Sunday, but I may be wrong. Andy Baran Nestl=E9 Waters North America Inc. (630) 435-9502 Ext. 506 (Office) (630) 988-3501 (Cell) (419) 715-2406 (Fax) -----Original Message----- From: t206guy@aol.com [mailto:t206guy@aol.com] Sent: Monday, July 22, 2002 10:47 AM To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] National on Tuesday anyone? Greetings all. Are any of you guys planning on being at the national on Tuesday the 8th? That will be the only day that I have a chance to attend, however I would like to try and make the trip. Dupes box would be there with me including a new batch of T card dupes. I probably would arrive tuesday at opening and I would have to leave Wed AM but if there are going to be any OBCers there I would love to run into you. LMK if you plan on being there that early and we will keep an eye out for each other. I will be sporting my OBC hat in case you fail to recognize me from the posters in the post office. Hope to see about 100 of you there. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor=09 To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . ================= To: Subject: Weekend Report Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 16:46:25 -0700 From: "Grant Rainsley" I want to get this part out of my system first....sure.... the Angels are about to make the move to get into their first Series, and they're all going to go on strike. Sure. Thanks a lot. Heck, they just swept the M's on the weekend. I swear, if there's another strike, I'm going to boycott the Majors forever, and just hang around the Minors. Single A has cheaper beer anyways. Anyways, had a call from a friend a few days ago asking if I could come help him clean out some junk from his shop...he owns a plumbing company, and the walls are decorated with Hot Wheels...100's and 100's of them. And the floor is just covered in boxes of cards, programs, memorabilia, etc. The closet is jammed with jerseys and other assorted memorabilia. He admits he got sucked in several years ago into thinking that buying Upper Deck, Score, etc. by the case lot was going to finance his retirement. I have told him many times that most of it is good as fire starter, but not much else. Finally, he decided he wanted to see the floor in his office. So....Saturday morning, I arrived at his shop at 9 sharp. Went through literally thousands of cards very quickly, putting them all into 800 count boxes, and told him to find a community garage sale and ask $5 a box, and take $3. Probably missed a lot of decent cards, but to be honest I have no interest and even less knowledge about newer stuff. After doing about 60 boxes, I was bagged, and said I needed a break....he was getting to me anyways, and kept saying things like "This 1993 Gretzky must be worth something"....yeah, about a dime I kept saying. When he saw me sagging, he said "This one must be worth something" and tossed the card across the table at me....luckily it was in a plastic holder...it was a very very nice '53 Mantle. Then a Mays...then a Spahn...then a Jackie....turns out he probably has around 80% of the set, all cards he kept from when he is a kid...(he's about to turn 60.) Every single one of the star cards was there, he needs some commons mostly. Most are in really nice shape, he said he never threw them against the wall, he was afraid he would lose them. On some, he didn't mind turning them into a "Traded" series though, but not many. Then, after enjoying that, he pulled out his '52's (no Hi #'s)....then his '54's. He was having a great time at this point, I was about ready to puke. He ended up sending me home with a bunch of stuff that he wants me to sell for him on Ebay..his daughter is getting married in Hawaii in December, and he wants some U.S. $$$$. Jeez, he already owns a condo over there... We broke and went for lunch and a brewskie, and he really lowered the boom on me. He told me what he thinks are his "best" cards are in the safe at his house...I don't know what to think now, since he thought most of a set of Upper Deck '92 hockey might be worth something big. All in all, quite a ================= Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 21:02:06 -0400 To: vct@lists.vintagecardtraders.com,obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com, Subject: The Virtual Card Collection - bigger and better than ever! From: Dan Austin http://www.iamdanaustin.com/virtual/ If you haven't been to my Virtual Card Collection site lately (or ever - shame on you!), there's a lot of new goodies waiting there to be checked out. The master list of sets on the site now looks like this: 1909 E95 Philadelphia Caramel 1909 T205 Gold Border 1909-11 T206 White Border 1910 American Caramel E90-2 1910 E96 Philadelphia Caramel 1910 PC796 Sepia Postcards 1911 E104 Nadja Caramels 1912 T201 Mecca Double Folders 1912 T207 Brown Background 1921 Exhibits 1927 Exhibits 1928 Exhibits 1933 Delong 1933 Goudey 1933 Sport Kings 1934-36 Diamond Stars 1934 Goudey 1935 Goudey 1936 Goudey 1938 Goudey 1941 Play Ball 1946 Remar Bread Oakland Oaks 1948 Bowman 1948 Signal Oil 1949 Bowman 1949 Bowman PCL 1948-49 Leaf 1950 Remar Bread Oakland Oaks 1951 Topps Connie Mack All-Stars 1952 Numnum 1953 Bowman Black & White 1953 Bowman Color 1954 Topps 1955 Topps 1960 Fleer 1960 Lake to Lake Dairy Braves 1961 Golden Press 1964 Topps Giant 1967 Topps Posters 1969 Topps Decals 1969 Topps Deckle Edge 1970 Topps Scratchoffs 1970 Topps Story Booklets 1972 Fleer Famous Feats 1978 Topps/Zest 2001 Donruss Notable Nicknames 2001 Upper Deck Legends Fiorentino Collection 2002 SP Legendary Cuts With more to follow... Hope to see you there! - Dan Dan Austin - dan@iamdanaustin.com Visit me at http://iamdanaustin.com "How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a good deed in a naughty world." - William Shakespeare ================= Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 21:35:37 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] National on Tuesday anyone? To: abaran@perriergroup.com, T206Guy@aol.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: ChicoD1@aol.com From what I was able to gather..Tues and Wed are specials for the dealers only. I think general admittance is Thursday-Sunday. I may be wrong, but take a look at the website http://thenational.net . ================= Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 23:02:00 EDT Subject: OBC- 52 Bowman Mantle To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com hi- this is Linda- there is a POOR condition 52 Bowman Mantle on ebay-# 1845887843- says from Dad's estate- looks like Dad didn't take too good a care of cards. eBay item 1845887843 (Ends Jul-29-0214:... ================= To: "OBC Ramblings (E-mail)" Subject: T206 eBay Prices Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 08:57:11 -0700 From: Steve Carter Is it just me, or have the prices on eBay for lower condition T206 cards gone up a lot in the past few months? I used to be able to find cards in GFP for about $5-7 each, now they start at $10 and go up from there. Just wondering if it was my imagination or not. Steve Carter Applications Engineering Manager Multek - Roseville (651) 697-8971 Direct (651) 697-8900 Main ================= To: "'jazzgirl1920s@aol.com'" , Subject: RE: [OBC-Ramblings] ebay 51 Bowman Mantle rookie Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:16:48 -0400 From: Mark Talbot Hello All, Just got back from SUNNY (and rainy) FLA and have begun to look over the plethora of emails that have overflowed the old mailbox. So let's see here, the final bid by a sniper with about 1 minute to go will be $905 for that Mantle Rookie card. So let me see here, Linda will therefore put in a $65 bid and be totally bewildered when it goes for 14 times that amount. How's that for hindsight. The card is beyond my affordability but we can always DREAM!!! In the meantime a reprint is just fine - BE WELL!!! REGARDS ---------- MARK -----Original Message----- From: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com [mailto:jazzgirl1920s@aol.com] Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2002 2:32 PM To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] ebay 51 Bowman Mantle rookie hi- this is Linda- there is a 51 Bowman Mantle rookie on ebay right now- # 1843648761 eBay item 1843648761 (Ends Jul-20-0208:... i wonder what this one will end up selling for ??? G- Vg?? Linda To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= To: "'Wite3@aol.com'" , nikkimmueller@yahoo.de, Subject: RE: [OBC-Ramblings] Family and baseball Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 12:50:31 -0400 From: Mark Talbot I only wish I could have been so wise at 25 years old Joshua. Great story with emotions I certianly can relate to - Thanks for sharing it. BE REGARDS ------- MARK -----Original Message----- From: Wite3@aol.com [mailto:Wite3@aol.com] Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2002 3:58 AM To: nikkimmueller@yahoo.de; OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com; ALYnCALI@aol.com Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] Family and baseball I just wanted to relay one happened to me today. It was a singular baseball experience but had rather unexpected impact on my life. As most of you already know, I gathered my love of baseball mostly from my grandfathers (mostly my mother's father) and my own father. Growing up, one or the other was always involved in my baseball experiences. Whether it was my first taste of major league experience with my grandfather taking me to a game at Dodger Stadium or my dad throwing the ball with me (still does to this day, and I hate to admit that he still has the better arm) I grew up with baseball around me. There have been times when my dad and my grandfather were there at the same time for one of my baseball memories including little league games, the occasional Dodger or Angel game, and even watching my father resume his baseball career at fifty. I cherished all those memories. In fact, my penultimate baseball moment was seen by both these gentlemen just a scant five years ago when I managed play one game dressed in Dodger home whites on the field at Dodger Stadium. But five years is a long time. Five years ago, I was 25 years old. My father was 54, just entering his third season of baseball, and my grandfather had just turned 80, still able to drive himself to Dodger Stadium to watch his grandson fulfill the dreams of three generations (if you missed that story, ask me, I will relay it in another letter). Five years have passed. Five short and long years. Which brings us to Saturday, July 13th. My season tickets are in the Loge level, which is one level up from the Field level at Dodger Stadium. My grandparents wanted to go to a Dodger game, so my parents decided to take them. Because of their advanced age and limited mobility, they bought Field level seats with handicapped access (just to the 1st base side of homeplate---some truly great house seats). I knew my parents were at the game but was not sure I would be able to get down to meet them, often the security does not let you go down to the field level. Thus, I met my friend and his father at the game, sat with them for the first three innings and then went in search of my parents. After five minutes of talking to a very dim security guard, I finally had to ask to see a senior usher. Showed the usher my season ticket, told him I wanted to visit my parents, flashed my MLBPAA card he escorted me down to where they were sitting. I came up behind my grandparents who were thrilled to see me at the game. I sat with my father on one side of my and my grandfather on the other. It was wonderful and made me feel like I was 10 years old again. It was amazing that the knowledge that my family has of the game has not diminished one bit. I watched amazed as Brian Anderson balked and my grandfather called it before the umpire even made the move to signal it. I then watched in awe as my father noted the shift in the outfield for Counsell and two seconds later he lined out to the outfielder who had to move one step to his left to make the play. As the game wound down to the final innings, I realized that I was in heaven. It was a great sunny California day and I was watching baseball with my family. Nothing better! As the eighth inning ended and my parents got up to help my grandparents start to leave, I realized that this would be the last time the three of us would be sitting at Dodger Stadium together. I think my mother noticed first, though because she was teary eyed. My grandfather has announced that because of his age and his lack of mobility, this will be his last season to attend Dodger games in person. I know he has one more game to go but I am not sure my father and I can attend it together. It was wonderful having the two of them there with me. We all stood up, hugged, said our good-byes and my family left just before the ninth inning started. I stayed until the end. I am glad I did. We were sitting with a man who had bought a scalped ticket. As my family left, he shook my dad's hand and my grandfather's hand. He then told us we had something truly special. As my family walked down the concourse and I lost sight of them, I turned back to our new friend to see him on his cell phone, calling his father back in New York. The family that sat behind us were two kids probably around 7 and 5. Both boys with their father who took them to get a program. When he came back he told me he got the programs for his kids so "they would remember the day their dad took them to the ballpark and would hopefully have memories like the ones my family has." As the game ended, I sat in the stands and talked baseball with the guy in front of my and the family behind. None of wanted to leave. Security finally asked us to leave. I walked to my car and could not drive home. I spent twenty minutes looking at the L.A. skyline. Finally, I managed to drive home. I vowed to watch more games at home with my grandfather as much as possible. As well as going to games with my father. One day, I hope to take my children to games with their grandfather. I only hope I will be as good a baseball and life role model as they both were. I love them both. PS Who won the game? Arizona 7-5. Did I care? Not a damn bit!!! Yahoo! Groups Sponsor here to find your contact To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service . ================= Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 13:16:17 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] T206 eBay Prices To: scarter@multek.com, obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Traderdoug@aol.com I don't think its your imagination. I've bought a few recently for under $10, but not many. - doug In a message dated 7/24/2002 10:57:48 AM Central Standard Time, scarter@multek.com writes: > Is it just me, or have the prices on eBay for lower condition T206 cards > gone up a lot in the past few months? > I used to be able to find cards in GFP for about $5-7 each, now they start > at $10 and go up from there. > Just wondering if it was my imagination or not. ================= Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 15:57:09 EDT Subject: re T206 ebay prices To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Celenox@aol.com No its not you ...Ever since topps came out with its new T206 set all the prices of t206s went up......I picked up one a few months ago for $11.00 and last week the same card worse condition went for $30,00...so we can all thank Topps for this increase to our T206s ================= Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 14:54:14 -0700 To: jazzgirl1920s@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] OBC- 52 Bowman Mantle From: It is going for $100 now, what is book? 10% in poor condition but it is the Big Al in Seattle On Tue, 23 Jul 2002 23:02:00 EDT jazzgirl1920s@aol.com wrote: hi- this is Linda- there is a POOR condition 52 Bowman Mantle on ebay-# 1845887843- says from Dad's estate- looks like Dad didn't take too good a care of cards. eBay item 1845887843 (Ends Jul-29-02 14:... ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Will You Find True Love? Will You Meet the One? Free Love Reading by phone! http://us.click.yahoo.com/7dY7FD/R_ZEAA/Ey.GAA/QBiolB/TM To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= To: Subject: '53 Mantle Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 15:20:44 -0700 From: "Grant Rainsley" Somebody's gonna be real unhappy pretty soon.... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1841621109 ================= Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 18:45:21 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] '53 Mantle To: grains@dccnet.com From: smart1853@aol.com One would think that they would be unhappy but positive feedback was left by the high bidder a week after close describing the seller as a very honest seller and stand up person. Perhaps the winner was a shill and left the feedback to cover for the obvious misrepresentation. ================= Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 18:46:48 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Thanks@yahoogroups.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Rick's 1995 list From: Neal Thomas Hi all- Jim Weihe found 2 of the cards off Rick's list on old ebay auctions, and they were delivered today--with incoming cards from one of my ebay buys, Ken M, and St. Al, we are now down to 3 cards: 189 (Rizzuto) 190 (Woodling) Any help to finish this off for Rick would be greatly appreciated. Thanks all. ================= To: Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] '53 Mantle Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 18:51:16 -0400 From: "John Collins" I send the seller a nasty-gram, and the buyer an e-mail notifying him of exactly what he purchased. Maybe that is meddling, but I can't stand it whenI see stuff like this. John C. Collins ----- Original Message ----- From: smart1853@aol.com To: grains@dccnet.com Cc: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] '53 Mantle One would think that they would be unhappy but positive feedback was leftby the high bidder a week after close describing the seller as a very honest seller and stand up person. Perhaps the winner was a shill and left thefeedback to cover for the obvious misrepresentation. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 21:15:58 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] T206 eBay Prices To: scarter@multek.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Wite3@aol.com Actually, some prices have gone up but that seems to happen in cycles. For some reason the prices go up during the summer (at least when I am tracking the T-205s). From what I have noticed there is more interest in the T-206 set lately because of the Topps promotion. Also, prices seem to go up online around the time of the National as well. Sort of odd. ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 23:26:48 -0700 Subject: Jeff Sackman's e-mail address...?? From: Peter Iversen Jeff or anyone out there.... Anyone got a good e-mail address for Jeff?? (Jeff are you reading this - send me your address...) I want to send Jeff a Thank You for some great cards and the e-mail got bounced back... >>----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- >>>>>>mailto:>>> jeff_sackmann@mailexcite.com Thanks for your time and the help - ================= Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 06:35:00 EDT Subject: Alabama tykes win series! To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: MatShirley@aol.com Hello OBC! Just wanted to brag on my relatives a bit. Joe Bob Whitt (coach) is my brother-in-law and Casey is my nephew. There is still much joy in the game, major leagues or no major leagues. Alabama tykes win series By Victoria Sun LAS VEGAS SUN Player salaries, contract negotiations and rising ticket prices weren't discussed among the family and friends sitting in the Arroyo Grande Sports Complex grandstand Sunday afternoon. The words "steroids" and "strike" never came up either. Hits and defensive plays were the only things these savvy fans cared about. As the (Huntsville) Alabama Rockets hung on for a 7-6 victory over the Murrieta (Calif.) Muddogs to win the U.S. Specialty Sports Association 10-under Major Division World Series, they remained riveted on every play. "This is baseball at its best -- kids playing from the heart, kids playing because they love the game," Rockets manager Joe Bob Whitt said. "The kids have been incredible. I'm as happy as they are. It's a great feeling to see the kids happy and the parents happy." Trailing 7-2, the Muddogs rallied for four runs in the sixth and final inning, capped by Konner Armigo's two-run homer that had the Rockets wide-eyed and worried. "I was scared," a group of relieved Rockets admitted in unison. Experiencing the highs and lows for each team were the enthusiastic spectators who shook noisemakers while repeating chants such as, "Base hit, home run, we don't care how it's done, drive one (player name)!" and "Let's go defense! On your toes! Who wants it?" After the Rockets finally got the third and final out of the troublesome sixth inning, the scene on the field mirrored the one in the stands. Congratulatory hugs and cheers all around. "It's just awesome," said catcher/left fielder Seth Gordon, standing in the infield with the Alabama state flag wrapped around him. "It just means a lot. We'll never have the chance to do this again." Gordon scored two runs while Casey Whitt had two RBIs and a double. Alabama pitcher Coty Blanchard, an all-tournament selection who doubled in two runs and scored one, stood next to catcher Nick Tanielu, who had two hits and an RBI, both smiling broadly but saying little. Perhaps Tanielu said it all as he walked among his teammates, both arms raised like a boxer who just went the distance and survived. "I'm just happy," he said. Blanchard and Tanielu did know how they wanted to celebrate. "We want to swim," they blurted out in unison. ================= Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 11:48:55 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Rick's 1955 list--2 left From: Neal Thomas Hey all- A very generous but anonymous OBCer has just put a '55 Snider in the mail, which leaves us two cards short of knocking off Rick's list. Here is what we still need: 189 (Rizzuto) 190 (Woodling) ================= Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:09:13 -0700 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: help them out From: First of all I do not work for the post office. With that disclaimer, why not help out a good clause and buy a book or two of the "hero" stamps. The USPS is selling stamps to aid the people in NY who were hurt in the tragedy of Sept 11. For .08 more you get to help and still mail your letters. Simple but if everyone uses the stamps it could bring in millions of dollars. Big Al in Seattle ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" Subject: directory Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 21:46:17 -0400 From: "Bob Donaldson" The latest directory I have is from 6/3/2002. Is there a newer one and if so could someone send it to me. ================= Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 15:04:18 -0700 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: rare type cards From: at the local dealer today and he offered some rare cards. I know some of you might be interested but they are not cheap. 51 Connie Mack (Topps All Star) Johnson 51 Topps Team Card PItt or Phil (not sure) yr? Fischer Bread Label Card (no tab) If you are interested in arranging a deal, LMK and I will get more info. He knows they are hard to come by and wants good money but not as bad as say Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 23:37:59 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Collectors ages & collection value From: "mikesportsfan" This ramble would make Morganti proud. Do NOT read unless you have a few minutes. I am sure this is my longest ramble ever. On occassion I wonder about the state of the hobby of collecting BB cards/sporrts memorabilia. Although, like many others in OBC, my collection is worth a considerable amount (I can only guess what Beckett's would value the collection at, vs. what an OBCer would pay - OBCers would probably value it high due to some of the OBC nature of my collection. The stories behind obtaining some of the cards increase their value to some OBCers.) I often wish that the value (cost) of my collection would go DOWN. There are a few reasons for this. If the value of what I have goes down, the value of what I still want should also go down. Since I do not plan on selling my collection, the current value is a detriment, not a bonus. I would love to show off my collection to more people. I do not feel "safe" showing it to just anyone. Too much temptation for stealing. Even showing the collection to people I trust is not a great idea, because they may tell someone about my collection and that person may want to rip me off. I do not think I am being paranoid about this (the world REALLY is against me. LOL) Due to the threat of a large loss, I have pulled the most valuable cards and have them in safety deposit boxes at the Bank. Again this is irritating because then my sets are not "complete" (at least at the house) and I cannot see them just anytime I want. This is suppose to be a hobby for me, these are some of the things that take away from the enjoyment. Over the last few years I have spent, by some standards a significant amount of money on my collection. Certainly in the thousands of dollars and since I first started collecting, in the tens of thousands of dollars. I have been very fortunate that I acquired much of my collection in the late 70s, early 80s, before prices sky rocketed. I could not afford to acquire my collection (209 cards to complete Topps BB 1951-1992; 297 cards to complete Bowman BB; 48 cards to complete Bowman FB; 54 to complete Topps Hockey pre-85; complete pre-80 Topps, Fleer, Bowman Basketball; complete Topps, Fleer, Philadelphia, Nu-Card FB 1951-1990, not counting all the inserts, oddballs and partial sets) at today's prices. The question is, if I ever think about selling my collection, what would I get for it? I am single with no kids. I do have 2 nephews, 1 of whom loves hockey cards. As of now he would get a large part of my hockey collection. Although many of us love to gripe about being sniped on Ebay, the prices realized in most cases are less than what we would want to sell our collections for. My thoughts are that card prices (at least in real $ terms) may come down in the future. A few reasons are economic. The stock market drop the last couple of years leaves people with less disposable income to buy cards. Also some people are "dumping" their cards for whatever they can get for them, to feed the family. The drop may also cause "investors/speculators" to stop buying cards, lessening demand and allowing prices to drop further. A demographic/economic factor is aging of the collector base (which was the reason I had for starting this ramble). Although I think the average age of OBC is higher than most other on-line groups, since we specialize in older cards, I think the average age of true collectors has gone up over the last 10 years. After the unbelievable amount of cards produced in 1987-1992 and the corresponding drop to worthless value of many cards in that era, many people got out of the hobby. The people that got out were not the hard core older collectors, like our group, but young kids who found the cards did not pay for college, etc. The older cards did not lose their value and have continued to go up ($220 for 52 Topps high numbers!). These cards have become unaffordable for many collectors. These collectors become discouraged and drop out of the hobby. Some will collect certain players or teams, instead of complete sets because of this. The demographics point out that as people with the best collections start selling off (or dying) there will probably be less collectors to buy these valuable collections. Think 20 years from now, when most baby boomers will be 58-74. How many people are going to want to buy early Topps cards or T cards that there is no one around to tell stories about the players. Many current collectors heard stories about players from the T card era, the 30s or 50s, from fathers and grandfathers. This will not be the case in the future. How many collectors now have heard many stories about players from the E card era? Maybe some of the players are known, because the sets were small and mainly stars were issued. I checked the 2-26-02 OBC directory and of the 129 members listed (not including Frank Thomas or the 2 guys whose birthdays were not listed) found that only 2 (John Hathcock, our most senior member, and Howrd Griz Morgan) were born in the 1930s. 24 more were born in the 1940s. Most popular decades for OBCers, were 45 from the 1950s and 47 from the 1960s. Some younger members - 9 from the 70s and our 2 babies, Sackman and Carlos Alcazar from the 80s. So the vast majority of our members are Boomers. Will there be collectors in Generation X to take our place? Maybe, as people born in the 70s and 80s get more established, they will have more money to get into collecting with and they will replace the older folks. Another factor is the lack of interest in BB. I collect all of the major sports. Some in our group collect multiple sports, but the majority are BB only. Is there anyone in the group that does NOT collect BB? Say a FB only collector? I am not aware if there are. My nephews have little to no interest in seeing a Tigers game (hard to blame them). When I was there age, I would do extra chores for my folks to take me to a game. My nephews play soccer, hockey, tennis and have other interests. BB is a low priority. I think this is typical of kids today (they are 9 and 12). If they are not fans of the game, why would they want to collect the cards? If they ae not fans now, what is the likelihood they will ever become fans? Just a lot of thoughts on where the hobby is going. Years ago, at the large shows like the National they would have discussions about the hobby. I do not think they do this anymore. I wonder what the hobby leaders (dealers?) think about this ramble. Does it make a difference? Am I wrong? Anyone wishing to continue this discussion outside the ramblings server (due to the lenghtiness of this subject matter), feel free to E-mail me direct. Sorry about the length of this ramble. Mike Rich ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 01:26:56 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Collectors ages & collection value To: Mikesportsfan@aol.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Wite3@aol.com My two cents...It does not seem so long ago (although I guess it is when you think about how long OBC has been around now) when I was the baby of the group. People often scoffed at my collection and my collecting habits. Why would a 19 year old be interested in Phillies that played in 1909. The answer was simple. I liked the history of the players, teams, and the cards. I see just as many "young" collectors at tables these days as old. In fact, I think that the nostalgia factor is starting to take off more and more. An example of this was at the National a few years back where I bought a T-206 for a kid just for the fact that his answer to the "Why do you want that card?" was that is was a piece of history, old, and he did not have one yet. He also thought it was neat owning something older than anything he had before. I think collectors--and unfortunately investors--will continue to collect older cards and read about the days of yore. About showing my collection. Pieces of my collection have been shown here and there to OBCers. My Phillies collection has been seen in its totality by only two people. My grandfather and my father. Peter I. has seen most of it including some of the higher value cards but I generally do not let people know of some of the cards I own including the Magie, and some high value oddities (except OBCers). Value? A lot. I am the ultimate bargain shopper but I have put a lot of time, money, and effort into my collection. If sold as a collection it would definitely value more than if sold piece by piece. ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:08:44 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Short venting ramble From: Neal Thomas Hi all- Since my wife is tired of hearing my complain about this, I figured I would share it with a group who is probably equally as I am absolutely sick to my stomach with what continues to go on with Ted Williams! The greatest hitter who ever lived should have earned much more respct in his lifetime than to allow the treatment of his remains to be left to a judge. I read this morning that the note John Henry produced yesterday is probably a forgery, and that JHW has forged Ted's signature for his own gain for many years. I think if it is found that this is not Ted's signature, then they should freeze John Henry's head and send it to Arizona, and let Ted rest in peace scattered over his beloved Everglades, which is where he wanted to be! ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:10:29 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Short venting ramble To: nthomas@pol.net, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com neal: the probably cant find an ice cube tray small enough to hold his head! ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Short venting ramble Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:15:27 -0400 From: "John Collins" I share your sense of frustration, and I also have a wife that is sick of hearing me talk about it. It is just a sad thing to know that for the greatest hitter in history, thereal life John Wayne, and all of the great things that Ted did and made happen, that his life will always have this footnote to the end of it. People will still talk about Ted in terms of baseball and hitting, and his war service, but they will always have to add in this stupid footnote about him being frozen. Not something that the Splinter deserved at all. John Henry Williams is an ungrateful little twerp who is simply determined to profit off his father no matter what it takes. It's just too bad that Ted himself couldn't control it in the end. John C. Collins ----- Original Message ----- From: Neal Thomas To: OBC Ramblings Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2002 10:08 AM Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] Short venting ramble Hi all- Since my wife is tired of hearing my complain about this, I figured I would share it with a group who is probably equally as I am absolutely sick to my stomach with what continues to go on with Ted Williams! The greatest hitter who ever lived should have earned much more respct in his lifetime than to allow the treatment of his remains to be left to a judge. I read this morning that the note John Henry produced yesterday is probably a forgery, and that JHW has forged Ted's signature for his own gain for many years. I think if it is found that this is not Ted's signature, then they should freeze John Henry's head and send it to Arizona, and let Ted rest in peace scattered over his beloved Everglades, which is where he wanted to be! Yahoo! Groups Sponsor To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:30:54 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Rick's 1955 list--down to one card! From: Neal Thomas Hi all- With incomings from ebay, anonymous, and Ken M still en route, I found one of the cards Rick still needs, and Bi Al sent another two today. So we are now down to a single card to put Rick's 55 set to bed--if anyone can get ahold of #189--RIzzuto, we can get this completed set off to Rick! Thanks, guys--a great effort by all. ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:39:08 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Rick's 1955 list--down to one card! From: Neal Thomas Contrary to my bad typing, BIG Al sent the cards! Sorry St Al.! ------------------ Reply Separator -------------------- Originally From: Neal Thomas Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] Rick's 1955 list--down to one card! Date: 07/27/2002 10:30am Hi all- With incomings from ebay, anonymous, and Ken M still en route, I found one of the cards Rick still needs, and Bi Al sent another two today. So we are now down to a single card to put Rick's 55 set to bed--if anyone can get ahold of #189--RIzzuto, we can get this completed set off to Rick! Thanks, guys--a great effort by all. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------- Will You Find True Love? Will You Meet the One? Free Love Reading by phone! http://us.click.yahoo.com/7dY7FD/R_ZEAA/Ey.GAA/QBiolB/TM To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= To: , , Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Collectors ages & collection value Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 10:40:39 -0400 From: "John Collins" I am one of the "70s babies" of the group, being born in '77making me 25 years For what it's worth, ever since I started collecting (at age 9 in 1986) I have always been way more interested in older cards than anything current. I discovered the older cards perhaps a year after buying many many packs of'86 Topps that were probably worth more then than they are now. I discovered some older cards (50's and 60's) for sale in an antique mall in my hometown and I was hooked. I guess the reasons for finding these cards more interesting are the same as some of you have already mentioned: I had always been a history buff and I wanted to learn more about the history of the game. Plus, it was neat just to own something "old." I remember houndingmy dad to try and find any cards that may still have existed from his childhood collection. The only thing that eventually turned up were some Philadelphia Inquirer Phillies newspaper cutouts from the 1950 season. I still have, and treasure those "cards" today. While continuing to collect newer releases as a kid, I eventually began trading the new stuff to other kids for older stuff. I had a trading friend in junior high school at one pointwho somehow discovered a source for old cards. I don't know what it was, maybe they were his dad's. But he would bring the cards to school and trade them to me for newer stuff that I didn't care about. Once I traded a "classic" company Bo Jackson card for a 1956 Topps Ernie Banks. That same kidalso once brought a beat up '52 Topps Mays to school, but for some reason he wouldn't trade me that one. In the end, I wonder too what will happen when the grade school age children of today grow up. It is clear that not nearly as many collect cards anymore. Will there be a place for them in OBC? Will OBC eventually turn to the overproduced sets of the 80's and 90's in a couple of decades? (They will certainly be cheap....). I guess only time will tell. John C. Collins ----- Original Message ----- From: Wite3@aol.com To: Mikesportsfan@aol.com ; OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, July 27, 2002 1:26 AM Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Collectors ages & collection value My two cents...It does not seem so long ago (although I guess it is when you think about how long OBC has been around now) when I was the baby of the group. People often scoffed at my collection and my collecting habits. Why would a 19 year old be interested in Phillies that played in 1909. The answer was simple. I liked the history of the players, teams, and the cards. I see just as many "young" collectors at tables these days as old. In fact,I think that the nostalgia factor is starting to take off more and more. An example of this was at the National a few years back where I bought a T-206 for a kid just for the fact that his answer to the "Why do you want thatcard?" was that is was a piece of history, old, and he did not have one yet. He also thought it was neat owning something older than anything he had before. I think collectors--and unfortunately investors--will continue to collect older cards and read about the days ! of yore. About showing my collection. Pieces of my collection have been shown hereand there to OBCers. My Phillies collection has been seen in its totality by only two people. My grandfather and my father. Peter I. has seen most ofit including some of the higher value cards but I generally do not let people know of some of the cards I own including the Magie, and some high value oddities (except OBCers). Value? A lot. I am the ultimate bargain shopperbut I have put a lot of time, money, and effort into my collection. If sold as a collection it would definitely value more than if sold piece by piece. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Click here to find your contact lenses! To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 11:02:03 EDT Subject: The Ballad of John Henry Williams. To: OBC-Ramblings@Yahoogroups.com From: malsman250@cs.com THE BALLAD OF JOHN HENRY WILLIAMS (My apologies - but I awoke Saturday morning, and this was firmly entrenched in my brain. I have to stop eating late-night pizzas.) When John Henry was a little baby, Sitting on his daddy's knee, He saw his dad autograph a baseball, Said, that's going to make a living for me, Lord, Lord, Going to make a living for me. Now his daddy got old, and real fragile, And his great eyes could just barely see, Well John Henry sat down, and he said to himself, This gravy train ain't gettin' way from me, Lord, Lord, This gravy train ain't gettin' way from me. Teddy Ballgame finally went on to his reward, And a dead man can't sign things for a fee, So John Henry snatched up his daddy's remains, And he chilled him like a bag of frozen peas, Lord, Lord, He chilled him like a bag of frozen peas. I think that its John Henry's intention, Though it may not be possible today, To sell off Ted's body piece by piece, As microscopic strands of DNA, Lord, Lord, As microscopic strand of DNA. ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 16:24:20 EDT Subject: Sarah Kennedy Pike ! To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: ehpiii@aol.com I made the mistake of getting the technology & homepage to work before making the announcement, but my wife & I are thrilled to announce the arrival of our new daughter just over a week ago. http://hometown.aol.com/ehpiii/myhomepage/babynews.html I will be trying to keep up with emails to me directly, but will not be reading messages on the listserver for a while. ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 14:31:25 -0700 To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Cig cards From: Does anyone do non sport Cigerette cards? Like Fish or Birds? Big Al in Seattle ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 18:18:02 -0400 (EDT) To: , OBC Ramblings Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Cig cards From: Neal Thomas I have been dabbling in the 1910 T58 Fish cards--I picked up a bunch at a Ft Washington show last year. ------------------ Reply Separator -------------------- Originally From: Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] Cig cards Date: 07/27/2002 02:31pm Does anyone do non sport Cigerette cards? Like Fish or Birds? Big Al in Seattle ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------- Will You Find True Love? Will You Meet the One? Free Love Reading by phone! http://us.click.yahoo.com/7dY7FD/R_ZEAA/Ey.GAA/QBiolB/TM To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 15:36:46 -0700 To: alcattle@earthlink.net, Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Cig cards From: Erik & Leticia Greenwood I collect about a half-dozen non-sport tobacco issues: (N Series: A&G Birds of America, Chickens, Arms of all Nations; T Series: Flags, Animals, World alcattle@earthlink.net wrote: > Does anyone do non sport Cigerette cards? Like Fish or Birds? > Big Al in Seattle > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > OBC-Ramblings-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= To: , Subject: THE NATL. cookout, swap, directions, hotels Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 18:23:14 -0500 From: "David Kolenda" Sorry about no update on the Natl for a few weeks. Things have been crazy with work, (Did manage to push a trip to Belgium off till after the Natl.),been having some e-mail problems, and trying to get a house ready to closebefore the natl. (MORE CARD MONEY). I don't know if anything has been set up to meet as a group at the natl one day. I would guess that Sat. is the best. Need some info or suggestions. If I read the e-mails right, the ones I get, it looks like Sal,Trips, Joel,and Gersh are added to the list of those attending the Natl. I might havemissed some as the e-mail has been a mess. Here are two hotels that are located about 5 min. from our house. A few had asked for this info. B E S T W E S T E R N Crossroads Inn 1905 Harder Court, Schererville, Indiana, United States, 46375 219-865-3400 Fax: 219-865-2800 Holiday Inn Express 1019 W Lincoln Hwy. SCHERERVILLE, IN 46375 UNITED STATES Local Phone: 1-219-8659500 Reservations: 800-HOLIDAY There is a cookout planed for Friday at our house. No starting time has been set in stone. Denise and I will be home most of the day getting things ready. WHATEVER TIME ONE SHOWS UP IS FINE. If you have family with you, BRING BRING YOUR WANTLISTS FOR ALL SPORTS ALL YEARS. I HAVE A BUNCH (BIG BUNCH) OF CARDS AND OTHER STUFF THAT COULD USE A NEW HOME. Below are directions to our house from most of the major roads in the area. If you need directions from another highway, let me know. If your totally lost on the way here, call 219 365 7753 >From Illinois 394, which starts at the junction of I-80, I-94, Get onto illinois 394 south (the only direction it goes). Go 9.4 miles to the 3rd stop light (exchange road) Turn left at stop light and continue for 4.6 miles to the 4th stop sign. Turn right on White Oak and go .6 miles to 107th st.(3rd street on the left. Turn left onto 107th, go to the 2nd street(ManorDrive) and turn right. 3rd house on the left is where it all happens (10733 Manor Drive) If you are coming south on I-294 (toll road). I-294 merges into I-80 east. Continue east on I-80 until you reach Illinois 394 ( approx 5 miles, give or take) from there follow the above directions. If you are coming from west of Chicago on I-80, when you reach Illinois 394, follow the above directions. If you are coming from from I-94, the Chicago area or north, stay on I-94 east until you reach Illinois 394, follow the above directions. If you are coming from the east of Chicago on I-94. Continue west on I-94 until you reach Indianapolis Blvd. Take the south exit on Indianapolis Blvd. Continue south for approx 10 miles and turn right on 109th street at thestop light. 109th st is the 2nd light after you pass the K-MART which willbe on the right approx 9 miles south on Indianapolis blvd(there will be a sign that shows route 231 to the left. A left takes you onto rt 231. A right puts you on 109th street. TURN RIGHT. Go .9 miles and turn right on Manor Drive. Manor drive is right across from the entrance to Palmoria golf course. Go to the 4th house on the right (10733 Manor Drive) ***OBC Swap Session*** Here is the official info from Ken Place: Midway (Best Western) Hotel (1600 Oakton St., Elk Grove Village, IL) Date: Saturday Aug. 10th Time: 7PM (or right after the show lets out, whichever comes first) to midnight (but I think we might be able to stay a couple hours longer if Admission price: None! Recommended: Bring your dupes box, wantlist, and a willingness to accept a boatload of cardboard thrown at you from all directions to add to your collection ;-) Menu: Pizza and soda will be provided courtesy of our generous host Kevin Savage. I will find out his table number at the show, so you will be able to express your appreciation personally. No outside food allowed however. I'm guessing other menu items are available at room service prices - the hotel is catering, so the room is free. In all it looks like a good gathering of OBCers for the weekend. ================= Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 13:17:08 EDT Subject: Cooperstown info wanted To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Glk@aol.com I am thinking of taking my 12 year old son to the Hall of Fame sometime in mid August and need some info about where to stay, what to see and what to avoid. Also, where is the best airport to fly into? Any help is appreciated. See you at the National! Joel ================= To: Subject: Standings Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 18:50:49 -0700 From: "Grant Rainsley" Quick, quick....take a look at the standings...there's something you don't get to see everyday, the Angels in first! I might save tomorrow's paper....bound to be worth something one day, a real momento. ================= Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 23:37:32 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC Ramblings Subject: Rick's 1955 list--completed in OBC fashion! From: Neal Thomas Hi all- I got a great email today from Ed Pike who has a "trim job that was ripped up by the dealer that got burned" 55 Rizzuto. Sounds like a perfect Pristine Tipton Mint 10, perfect to finish off Rick's 1955 set. OBCers did a great job with this one--it was tough, with some hard cards missing. Once I get a few of the incomings (ebay, anonymous, Ed and Ken M) here, I will package them with a get well card and get them off to Rick ASAP. Thanks, guys! Pat yourselves and each other on the back for this one! ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 00:13:19 EDT Subject: Angels To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: Wite3@aol.com Not often I get to Angels game anymore, but since I have time on my hands and my favorite American Leauge team comes to town this week (Red Sox) I might go to a day game. I love the way the Angels play and have been watching them since Soscia (sp?) took over. I met him on my dream day as he introduced himself to us...he has the Angels playing the best true baseball of any team (although the Twins and to a lesser degree the Expos are having similar success)...small ball, station to station, solid defense, and nearly no mistakes. Go Angels!! ================= To: Subject: Fw: Thank you so very much! Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 23:10:10 -0700 From: "AL Cummings" I feel it was worth the small effort. Thanks to everyone who helped. Big AL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick Redpath" To: Cc: "Lynn Miller" Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2002 6:08 PM Subject: Thank you so very much! > Dear Al, > Rick received the package you sent on Wednesday. He was completely > overwhelmed with both surprise and emotion. His ability to express > thoughts is still quite limited, so he began many sentences, such as "You > can't believe..., This is such amazing..., I can't even begin to > ...wonderful. As you can see, although he couldn't get out the complete > thought, he was totally touched by both the idea that you all would do > an amazing thing for him, and the cards themselves. > Since then, he has talked about trying to compose a message to thank > all with the agreement that I would help. So far, he has been frustrated > his inability to say what he feels. He thinks that he will never really > able to put into words how amazing it was to receive that package, and > all of the thoughts and effort that went into it means to him. > We agreed that we would wait a few days and he would try again. Until > then, I would send a message from him letting you know that he is thinking > of you all daily, and appreciates so much your kindness and generosity. > I would just like to add that for many years I was somewhat jealous of > how much time Rick spent on the computer, writing and thinking about > baseball, and this group he belonged to. Rick has never been especially > comfortable in social situations, and this group allowed him to share and > a part of something he truly loves with people he genuinely admires and > feels affection for. I came to realize that this group provided something > that made his life more complete and enjoyable. I cannot thank you all > enough for giving him the experience of your friendship and compassion. > It is one more thing he has and wants to hold on to and fight for. > He continues to move forward slowly. We are grateful for everyday. > Once again, thank you all so much and please pass our message on to > everyone that has been involved in this wonderful gesture. > Fondly, > Roberta Redpath ================= To: Subject: New Heights in Slabbed Cards Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 06:24:56 -0700 From: "Grant Rainsley" Without doubt, this is the funniest auction I have ever encountered...this one deserves a spot on the OBC website somewhere! Its funnier than the "Invisible Mantle" card which is on Ebay right now... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1841138061 ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 06:53:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Fwd: Unable to deliver your message To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: John Storman Date: 27 Jul 2002 10:10:01 -0000 To: jstorman2001@yahoo.com From: Yahoo! Groups Subject: Unable to deliver your message We are unable to deliver the message from to . Your email account has been bouncing mails. This means that emails sent to your account over several days have been returned to us. This is sometimes because mail boxes are filled up, or because of configuration problems. To reset your Yahoo! Groups account, please go to http://groups.yahoo.com/myprefs?edit=2 For further assistance, please email support@yahoogroups.com or visit http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/ ================= To: 'Grant Rainsley' , OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [OBC-Ramblings] New Heights in Slabbed Cards Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:46:18 -0400 From: Mark Talbot What a HOOT!!! Thanks for the chuckle!!! REGARDS -------- MARK -----Original Message----- From: Grant Rainsley [mailto:grains@dccnet.com] Sent: Monday, July 29, 2002 9:25 AM To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: [OBC-Ramblings] New Heights in Slabbed Cards Without doubt, this is the funniest auction I have ever encountered...this one deserves a spot on the OBC website somewhere! Its funnier than the "Invisible Mantle" card which is on Ebay right now... http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1841138061 To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:51:38 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] New Heights in Slabbed Cards To: talbotm@huronacademy.org, grains@dccnet.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smartalecx@aol.com In a message dated 7/29/02 2:42:13 PM Central Daylight Time, talbotm@huronacademy.org writes: > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1841138061 too bad one of the early bidders, el shillito bandito got sniped at the end! ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 23:03:01 -0000 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: BB strike alternative From: "mikesportsfan" With the potential for another ridiculous BB strike/lockout and the degree of disgust I have at the mere possibility of it, I had a thought (the thought could die of lonliness in my mind). A few of us have seen and commented on Vintage BB. For those that need a refresher, Vintage BB, are teams that play according to rules from the 1800s. Depending on the team/tournament the rules can differ. Afterall, the 18860s was a different game than the 1880s. I digress. The main theme running through all of the Vontage games I have seen (about 8 of them now)is that, it is a game to be enjoyed. They use to advertise it as a game of exercise for "gentlemen". There was only 1 umpire (often dressed in a coat and tails with top hat) who would inquire of the players the proper call on close plays. A runner is to "admit" if the trow beat him and likewise the 1st baseman should fess up if the throw was late or pulled him off the bag. There is no sliding and a batter is out if a batted ball is caught in the air OR on 1 bounce. They often do not use gloves, but play barehanded. There is no cussing allowed and you are NOT to challenge an umpires call. You are to thank the umpire for his explanation and efforts at facilitating the game. BB, the way in was meant to be played. Teams still played to win, but would not do so at the risk of the integrity of the players or the game. Safety is the most important rule for the players and This reminds me a little of OBC and BB card collecting the way it was meant to be. Helping each other complete our sets, not investing at the next rookie card. My suggestion is that if there is a strike to contact the newspapers in the cities and get a campaign going to have Vinatage BB played in th major league stadiums. Fans would get entertainment from players who love the game and see a style of play they have not seen before. I understand there was a Vintage game played at Tiger Stadium last year, in between games of some sort of semi-pro doubleheader. The game was organized on 3 or 4 days ntice and had no publicity. The players loved it. Getting to play at a former major league stadium. If these games were at all successful, it might show the owners and players that it is the game we love and not the spoiled millionaires who should be ashamed of themselves for what they are doing to the I have yet to meet a fan of the game who did not enjoy watching a Vintage game. LMK if you are interested in starting such a campaign if there is a strike. Mike "the recent Rambler" Rich ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 20:51:10 EDT Subject: Press time To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com, qbskolnik@hotmail.com, Gontomex@aol.com From: topgolf@aol.com I contributed to a story in today's Las Vegas Review Journal. to view it, go to lvrj.com and click on "yard landscaping.." keep in mind that the camera DOES add 10 pounds..... Rest well, ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 22:45:48 EDT Subject: Re: cooperstown info To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: dsh46@aol.com flying to cooperstown means flying to oneonta i think, or albany, then renting a car. we stayed in oneonta at the holiday inn--don't stay there, it was expensive and run down. there was a place just down the road (also in oneonta) called sabatini's little italy that was brand new and had $60 rooms (but no pool i believe). they had a great restaurant too. there's a best western near cooperstown (i think in milford ?-it's on route 28 at any rate) that looked nice. most cooperstown motels are hellholes and i would not recommend them. do walk main street in cooperstown, do NOT buy anything except caps or t-shirts, the prices are ridiculous otherwise. it's a fun trip though--just hold on to yer wallet. ================= Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 22:59:47 -0400 To: obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com,vct@lists.vintagecardtraders.com Subject: Pre-war gurus -- lend me your talents! (What do I have? E121? From: Dan Austin I have a card of Sam Harris (2nd B, Washington) that I thought was from the E121 series of 120 (1922 American Caramel). Unfortunately, this player is not listed in the set. The design SCD shows for the E122 set looks just like this card (the name and team are inside the black border and not outside like in the 121s and the player IS listed in the E122 set. However, SCD lists this set as "series of 80" and nothing is mentioned about a series of 120 like there is for the E121 set. On the back of this card, it says "120" and not "eighty". Is this just an unnoted variation in the set, or was there also a series of 120 for E122 not listed in SCD? Or is it something else? Help! - Dan Dan Austin - dan@iamdanaustin.com Visit me at http://iamdanaustin.com "How far that little candle throws his beams! So shines a good deed in a naughty world." - William Shakespeare ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: To my fellow Tigers fans in OBC.... Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 7:17:01 +0000 From: Are any of the OBC Tigers fans going to the National? If so, do you think you could let me know? I have a question for you. Glenn Codere Glasgow, Scotland ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: A National Request Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 8:22:51 +0000 From: I had intended directing this only to the Tigers fans who are attending the National, but it dawned on me that it might be more advantageous to me to ask you all. Steve Rittenberg, for his sins, has very kindly agreed to be my designated shopper at this year’s event. For this I’m extremely grateful. There is, however, one particular item that has been sort of “up there” at the top of my list for some time, and I was hoping that if any of you were to happen across it, perhaps you could pick it up for me. As many of you know, as well as cards I also collect autographed 8x10s of Tigers players – nearly 110 photos in the collection so far! I’m particularly proud of my 1968 team collection which lacks only deceased players Don McMahon, Ray Oyler, Bob Christian, Norm Cash, Joe Sparma, and manager Mayo Smith (although I do have other autographed items of the latter three). The collection also lacks one living player. Pitcher Jim Rooker. Rooker only played a handful of games for Detroit during ’68 before being drafted by the Royals in ’69. He went on to win a World Series ring with the Pirates. I know that there is a dealer that I met at the Atlanta National a few years back who specialises in Tigers items. Unfortunately, he didn’t have a web presence, and I managed to lose his address very shortly afterwards. If any of you come across this guy, or for that matter anyone else who may be selling auto’d 8x10s, I wonder if you could take the time to enquire about a Rooker for me. I would most likely expect to pay something in the region of $20-$30 for the item, and may even go slightly more if need be. My one over-riding conditional requirement is that the photo MUST feature Rooker in Tiger uniform (and this, my friends, is what may prove to be tricky). I’d be very grateful if any of you could put me on to someone who may be selling this item. Better yet, if they actually have one, and you could pick it up for me, I’d be more than happy to reimburse you for all your costs. To all of you who are attending this year’s National, have a terrific time! I hope you manage to find everything you hope to! Cheers for now! Glenn Codere Glasgow, Scotland ================= Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:18:36 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: Famers want to avert strike From: Originaleek@webtv.net ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: OBCers in Chicago or National attendees Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 13:11:49 +0000 From: "Brad Chambers" If anyone will be available next week, I'll be in Chicago from Sunday night thru Friday afternoon when I have to leave unfortunately. I'll be available any night, and thought I might try to get to the National on Thursday which is free day, although I couldn't even leave to go there from Ft Sheridan before 5, so it might not work. Anyway, let me know if anyone wants to get together. Going to try to work out something with Joel and anyone else Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ================= Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 10:40:46 -0400 Subject: Re: [VCT] Pre-war gurus -- lend me your talents! (What do I have? To: Dan Austin From: Mark S Talbot Quite the mystery Dan, I looked up this card on my sources and find the question perplexing. Sam Harris is listed in the E-120 set of 240 cards but the design is completely different than what you describe Dan. Strangely I could not find a listing for the player in the E-122 set as you claimed you found Dan, an interesting dilemma I'd say. I am confused and admittedly I am no expert on this one so I will be looking forward to the replies of the more informed collectors in our groups. GOOD LUCK!!! REGARDS --------------------------------- MARK "Live long and prosper" - Spock * Mark S. Talbot * * 34030 Chatsworth Drive * * Sterling Heights, MI. * * 48312-4604 * * talbot1@comcast.net * Dan Austin wrote: > I have a card of Sam Harris (2nd B, Washington) that I thought was from the > E121 series of 120 (1922 American Caramel). Unfortunately, this player is > not listed in the set. The design SCD shows for the E122 set looks just > like this card (the name and team are inside the black border and not > outside like in the 121s and the player IS listed in the E122 > set. However, SCD lists this set as "series of 80" and nothing is > mentioned about a series of 120 like there is for the E121 set. On the > back of this card, it says "120" and not "eighty". Is this just an unnoted > variation in the set, or was there also a series of 120 for E122 not listed > in SCD? Or is it something else? Help! > - Dan > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Dan Austin - dan@iamdanaustin.com > Visit me at http://iamdanaustin.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > "How far that little candle throws his beams! > So shines a good deed in a naughty world." > - William Shakespeare > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > _____________________________________________________________ > -- Check out the VCT website at: http://www.vintagecardtraders.com > -- Interested in your own VCT e-mail address? Let Dan know today! > -- E-mail the entire group at vct@lists.vintagecardtraders.com ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" Subject: The HOF's letter and Selig Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 12:38:45 -0400 From: "John Collins" I read today in a news article the news about the hall of famers stepping up and saying what they think baseball should do to avoid another strike. Ithink it's great that they are making their feelings known, and that they side with the fans. One would think that the 40 greatest living baseball players stating their opinion on such a matter would get it a lot closer to being resolved, but apparently Czar Bud decided that is not to be the case. When reached for comment, Bud said that he was glad that the HOFers shared his "deep concern"for the welfare of the game, but that mediators should only be brought in (as the hall of famers suggested) only if the current "collective bargaining process" fails. What does he think it is doing?!! Sheesh, how dense isthis guy? Baseball Weekly, to which I subscribe, came out with a poll of fans last week in which 86% of those surveyed felt that Bud should resign, no questions asked. What is it going to take for this guy to "get it?" John C. Collins ================= Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 18:13:48 EDT Subject: web sites and down time To: Smartalecx@aol.com From: smartalecx@aol.com hi: i happen to be one of those folks who, while pretending to work during the day, is working on my baseball card collection. i have noticed with more and more frequency that it is becoming more difficult during the business day to access wantlists if they are on "aol hometown". so here is my question. how difficult and/or expensive would it be to set up a server to handle all of the wantlists, all centrally located, and pretty much the only drain on the server resources? if every member of the four main trading groups contributed to some common fund (i am not suggesting we merge groups, just use our combined resources to purchase capacity), we would have some fairly big numbers and could do some pretty exciting things (in know it may be heresy to suggest such a thing, but it might work this one time for the common good of the hobby), and there would be some standardization of wantlists, making it easier to create databases and thereby "suggest" trading activity. i am pretty much (ok, totally) a computer ignoramus, but it seems like a good idea. any of you techno folks have any comments? ================= Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:57:53 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Digest Number 450 To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com, dan@iamdanaustin.com From: Jrhatchjr@aol.com I can't be considered an expert, but since I like puzzles such as this I did a little research. This may create more questions than answers, but here's what I came up with... The 2002 SCD Catalog does indeed list a Sam Harris in the E122 set. In fact, it lists him as Stan "Bucky" Harris, who is in the Hall of Fame. The SCD book lists the set as a "series of 80" although there are more than 80 cards listed (82 cards total, including a Fred Schupp variation and two different George Sislers). A 1982 article published in Baseball Cards magazine (don't know who worte it, as I don't have the cover page) speculates that "it seems likely that there should be one [E122] for each player in E121." At the time, only 66 subjects were known. In Lew Lipset's Encyclopedia of Baseball Cards Volume 2 (1984), 78 cards were known in E122, but Harris was apparently not one of them as he is not listed in the E121/E122 checklist. None of the sources here, in addition to Ron Erbe's American Premium Guide to Baseball Cards (1981) mention anything about a "120 subjects" variation in So...what do you have? Search me ;-) Happy Collecting! In a message dated 7/30/02 6:24:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com writes: > Message: 8 > Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 22:59:47 -0400 > From: Dan Austin > Subject: Pre-war gurus -- lend me your talents! (What do I have? E121? > E122?) > I have a card of Sam Harris (2nd B, Washington) that I thought was from the > E121 series of 120 (1922 American Caramel). Unfortunately, this player is > not listed in the set. The design SCD shows for the E122 set looks just > like this card (the name and team are inside the black border and not > outside like in the 121s and the player IS listed in the E122 > set. However, SCD lists this set as "series of 80" and nothing is > mentioned about a series of 120 like there is for the E121 set. On the > back of this card, it says "120" and not "eighty". Is this just an unnoted > variation in the set, or was there also a series of 120 for E122 not listed > in SCD? Or is it something else? Help! > - Dan ================= Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 18:06:37 -0700 To: Jrhatchjr@aol.com Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Digest Number 450 From: I was looking through a catalog today and might have found a clue. What you described looked like the E220 National Caramel set. It did not give the complete list but it was issued in 1921 and had the name, pos. and team inside the border. Might be the answer. Big Al in Seattle On Tue, 30 Jul 2002 20:57:53 EDT Jrhatchjr@aol.com wrote: I can't be considered an expert, but since I like puzzles such as this I did a little research.  This may create more questions than answers, but here's what I came up with... The 2002 SCD Catalog does indeed list a Sam Harris in the E122 set.  In fact, it lists him as Stan "Bucky" Harris, who is in the Hall of Fame.  The SCD book lists the set as a "series of 80" although there are more than 80 cards listed (82 cards total, including a Fred Schupp variation and two different George A 1982 article published in Baseball Cards magazine (don't know who worte it, as I don't have the cover page) speculates that "it seems likely that there should be one [E122] for each player in E121."  At the time, only 66 subjects were known. In Lew Lipset's Encyclopedia of Baseball Cards Volume 2 (1984), 78 cards were known in E122, but Harris was apparently not one of them as he is not listed in the E121/E122 checklist. None of the sources here, in addition to Ron Erbe's American Premium Guide to Baseball Cards (1981) mention anything about a "120 subjects" variation in So...what do you have?  Search me ;-) Happy Collecting! In a message dated 7/30/02 6:24:31 AM Eastern Daylight Time, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com writes: Message: 8   Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 22:59:47 -0400   From: Dan Austin Subject: Pre-war gurus -- lend me your talents! (What do I have? E121? E122?) I have a card of Sam Harris (2nd B, Washington) that I thought was from the E121 series of 120 (1922 American Caramel).  Unfortunately, this player is not listed in the set.  The design SCD shows for the E122 set looks just like this card (the name and team are inside the black border and not outside like in the 121s and the player IS listed in the E122 set.  However, SCD lists this set as "series of 80" and nothing is mentioned about a series of 120 like there is for the E121 set.  On the back of this card, it says "120" and not "eighty".  Is this just an unnoted variation in the set, or was there also a series of 120 for E122 not listed in SCD?  Or is it something else?  Help! - Dan Yahoo! Groups Sponsor href="http://rd.yahoo.com/M=225674.2075965.3644786.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705123920:HM/A=1153174/R=7/*http://www.lensexpress.com">Click here to find your contact lenses! To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ================= Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 23:22:21 -0400 (EDT) To: OBC-RAMBLINGS@Yahoogroups.com Subject: 1921-23 National Caramel (E220) 121 cards (115 players w/5 guys on From: keithsummers@webtv.net To: Jrhatchjr@aol.com From: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 18:06:37 -0700 Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] Digest Number 450 Subject: Pre-war gurus -- lend me your talents! (What do I have? E121? E122?) ================= Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 03:33:34 EDT Subject: Yearly T-205 Back Report with some new information To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com, HMorgan707@aol.com, TPLY@aol.com, From: Wite3@aol.com Okay...it has been almost exactly one year since my last T-205 report and some new information and updates to existing information is needed. First off, for those of you who do not know my little adventure in the T-205 set. I managed to pick up three of the five "key" cards in this set for under a $100 and decided that I should try to put it together. That was six years ago. Now, I am happy to report that with the two cards I managed last week, I am down to just 26 cards although most are of the "I rarely see" or " I will never own" version. Also have done a little off-condition shopping this year. As a result, I am not including my set as a seperate report in this large report as it is not really a decent sampling of a true population report (For some reason, I just love the Polar Bear backs on T-205s). On the other hand, I have looked at more catalogs, auctions, and sales this year. I have compiled all the data and now have nearly 3000 (yep, three thousand) cards. Granted, some of these might be duplicates, but not enough to make any statistical difference. I have also talked to a few other collectors and dealers for their input and have come to some conclusions about the back color variations. Also, I have choosen not to include factory designations just because I have not really seen or heard of any odd rarities concerning different factories. So here is the population report. Keep in mind, I have included some of the rarer cards now including all Minor Leaugers (Hassan or Polar Bear only), the Joss which seems to come in only three backs, the Gray w/ Stats that only seems to come in the Soveriegn back, the Moran w/ stray line that seems only to come in Piedmont (although a few collectors swear it comes in more), and a few other odd combinations. T-205 Backs: Piedmont 757 Sweet Cap Red 467 Honest Long Cut 441 Sweet Cap Black 427 Polar Bear 339 Hassan 201 Soverign 69 (Some say two color variations light/dark green but really just fading or lighter printing ink) American Beauty Blackish/Brownish 37 Cycle 35 American Beauty Green 9 Broadleaf brown 7 Broadleaf black 6 Blank Back 4 (Two were the thick advertising pieces/two seemed just to be missing the back printing) Hindu 4 Drum 1 (still just the one) Total 2804 cards. As you can see, I have pulled apart the American Beauty backs into two colors as a handful of the green ones showed up this year (including one in my set). When this happened, you can see the Cycle jumped up a notch. I have also included the blank backs I have seen. Now there is a slight problem here. There was a cardboard advertising piece (never seen the whole thing intact, but have seen a few of the pieces cut apart at the National 7 or eight years ago including the Moran that I own). I also now own what seems to be just a regular T-205 that did not have the reverse printing. Same size, thickness, and cardboard color. I have still only seen one Drum back in the past three years for sale or auction (the same card came up for auction twice in the past two years though). Anybody have a Drum to trade for one of the two Hindus I own? Hope you enjoyed it this little exercise in collecting. Any input or questions will be gladly accepted. ================= To: "OBC Ramblings" Subject: White Plains NY Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:18:05 -0400 From: "Bob Donaldson" I will be in White Plains August 12-16. I noticed this card show around the same time; August 15-18, 2002 Tri Star 15th annual Labor Day Collectors Show White Plains, NY East Coast National Westchester County Center any OBCers attending this show? Is it worth going? Thanks Bob ================= To: vct@yahoogroups.com; obc-ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: '70 Rose available Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 11:22:40 -0700 From: "jcollins12" Hi all, I have available for trade a 1970 Topps Pete Rose #580 that is in at least Ex-Mt condition and well centered. If at all possible, I would like to trade this card for a 1972 Topps Rose #559 that is in approx. the same condition and centered decently. I have tenatively decided to start putting together a '72 set, so I figured if possible it would be nice to trade one Pete for another. Both cards have a high book value of $50. If you need this card, but don't have a '72 Pete, I will take offers. The next best thing would be maybe an older Rose card (60's?) in lesser condition (Ex or worse) but I will listen to Thanks, let me know if interested. ================= To: OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com Subject: me, &c Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 19:40:21 +0000 From: "Jeffrey Sackmann" Hello all, I've received a bunch of thank yous from folks I sent cards to in the last few weeks, and a bunch of questions about my mysterious Wisconsin return address label. So you all know, my new address is: Jeff Sackmann 5006 Whitcomb Dr., Apt. 2 Madison, WI 53711 which will be reflected in the next directory. I finished up my undergraduate degree at NYU, and in a month I'll begin a PhD in English Lit at the University of Wisconsin-Madison. I'll be at the National on Thursday (I think), so I hope to see many of you That's all for now... Jeff S. MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ================= Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 18:27:45 EDT Subject: Re: [OBC-Ramblings] White Plains NY To: bdonaldson@callisma.com, OBC-Ramblings@yahoogroups.com From: smart1853@aol.com Myself and Rob Gioia are planning on meeting up either Thursday or Friday at the show. I have been to 3 shows at the County Center this year. There are many dealers that have vintage to offer and as many or more that are dealing in newer cards or high grade vintage. I know of a few dealers that have hundreds or thousands of singles from the 70s in dime boxes and have nicer examples from the 60s and 70s in binders going for about 40-50% book value. There is one dealer there that routinely has boxes on top of his case stuffed with 53 Bowman Colors, 52 Topps, 55 Bowmans and more priced anywhere from $1-5. I managed to buy 13 1952 Topps off of him back in January for a reasonable price. I also know of a guy that has been there each of the three times I have been and he has miscellaneous 50 cent boxes along with boxes of older Topps cards. I enjoy going to these shows to refill my dupes box and try and get some good deals on cards for my sets that don't get hit often. Perhaps the three of us and any other OBCers in the area can meet up. Talk to you soon, Brian Dwyer